Conference moira::parenting_v3

    Last summer, when Alison was about a year old, she started waking up at
    around 5.00 am.  I thought it was a seasonal thing due to light
    mornings - in spite of the fact that we have really thick
    curtains in her room, which block out most of the sunlight.  She 
    had stopped having an early morning feed by the time it started and had
    also stopped "demanding" food as soon as she woke up, so what with
    this, and the fact that she was a bit older than Christopher is (and
    the fact that she is a totally different child!) might mean that what
    we did to "cure" this might not work for you.  
    
    I decided that there was an acceptable time to be up and awake - for us
    it is 6.30 am (the time we have to get up to go to work) and if Alison
    woke up before that, she would have to learn that it was an
    unacceptable time to be awake.  Now that might sound wicked and
    heartless, but my husband and I are both people who really NEED our
    sleep, and get very bad tempered when we're not getting enough sleep -
    which in turn was not a good thing for Alison.  All (all?) I did was to
    use the Ferber technique - even though it was morning I "pretended"
    that it was still the middle of the night.  Alison would wake up and
    want attention.  I would go into her room and say in a very sleepy
    voice (which wasn't difficult) "It's not time to get up.  It's still
    the middle of the night.  Go back to sleep".  I would wind up the
    musical mobile, and leave the room.  When the musical mobile had
    finished (about 3 minutes), if she was still crying, I would repeat the
    process.  Sometimes it would take about 20 minutes but she would go
    back to sleep.  If whe woke up again before 6.30 I would repeat the
    process.  Obviously there were "grey" areas - like if she woke up at
    6.20 am - it wasn't worth pushing the point that she should sleep until
    6.30!   
    
    Some people might decide that it wasn't worth the effort -
    I had to keep getting out of bed and going back into Alison's room, but
    after a few mornings of taking Alison down stairs to play with her at
    5.00 am, I decided that it definately was worth the effort - that wiped
    me out more than using the Ferber techinique!  After a few weeks of
    using this technique it got to the point where Alison would either
    sleep in to about 6.30, or would go back to sleep after one "early
    morning visit".  The "problem" seemed to go away by about September
    time, when the mornings got darker, and she started sleeping until 7.30
    - 8.00.  She did start waking up early again this year when the morning
    started getting lighter, but again it only took a few days of going in
    to her once before she started sleeping longer again.  She still sleeps
    in a cot (crib) but next year, when she's in a bed, I suspect life may
    not be so easy, and we may have more compulsory early mornings!
    
    Sorry to ramble on, as I said, what worked for us may not work for you, 
    but I hope that one way or another, Christopher starts sleeping in a bit
    later in the mornings - I know how tiring those 5.00 am starts are.
    
    _ Janet 
    
    
    

    Hi Janet... 
    
    	yes, I agree, it's definitely worth trying that approach. All week
    now Christopher has been awake at 5 am and most mornings he's fallen
    asleep again at about 6:30. It's so frusrating - he wakes at 5am, has
    his milk (on his own) but  then as soon as that's finished the crying
    starts. This morning I actually left him (to be honest I think I fell
    asleep again!) until 5:45 ,at which time he was still crying. When I
    then went in to him I found him sitting in the middle of his cot
    joyfully waving his arms around to be picked up! So I relented and he
    came back to our bedroom, but after about 5 minutes (by which time I
    was sick of being crawled over and having my hair pulled by a
    wide-awake little monster!) he was deposited on the floor to play with
    toys. This he did (noisily) interspersed with crying a general
    grumpiness because we wouldn't get up and play with him. By 6:30 he was
    fast asleep again, which meant that I had to wake him (revenge!!) to
    dress him and to go to his childcare.
    
    	I guess the fact that he falls asleep again, even after an hour or
    so of waking, must mean that he's not really ready to be up at 5 am???
    Hopefully it's just another stage in growing up...
    
    		Ann

It probably won't help the basenoter right now, but maybe .1 ??

>							  She still sleeps
>    in a cot (crib) but next year, when she's in a bed, I suspect life may
>    not be so easy, and we may have more compulsory early mornings!
    
    As soon as my son was old enough to understand what different numbers
    were, even if he didn't know what they meant, I put an alarm clock/radio
    in his room (digital readout, of course :-) ) and told him what his
    "time to get up" was.... this was really great on the weekends when
    I wanted to sleep a *little* later ......

      " if the clock says 8 0 0, you can get up and watch cartoons "

     we also had guidelines, as he got older and could remember more than
     one set of numbers, that there was an "ok" time to be awake and read/
     play quietly in bed, and a "not ok" time to be awake and about - if
     he woke up before the "not ok" time, he could go to the bathroom but
     then had to go back to bed, no lights on, no toys/books........

    All of this probably doesn't help you right now, but it's something
    to consider as they get older !! 
    
    Debbi
    
    

    Moderator note:
    
    The title of this note has been changed to make searches easier.
    
    Laura

    Janet (.1), you used much the same method I did.  I'm not sure how you
    worked it, but one of our first investments for his room was a room
    darkening shade.  It kept the room dark until we raised the shade.  Now
    this sounds great,until..... it came time to leave the shade raised
    slightly in the warmer weather to allow a breeze to flow at night.
    
    Unless I snuck in just before dawn and pulled the shade down he was up
    at the crack of dawn announce "it's morning mom, time to wake up",  I
    love that child, but don't bug me at 5am!!
    
    We still use a modified method of this, we continue the roomdarkening
    shades, but we shut the window, pull the shade and either put a fan on
    low, if it's cool enough or put his Air Conditioner unit on low, just
    barely cooling.  The darkness and the "white" noise seem to make it
    easy for him to sleep just a little later, like I'd settle for 7:30
    these days-and it works!
    
    Lyn
    (who can't remember the last time I slept past 8am!)
    

    
    I'm not sure this is acceptable for everyone but it was our solution.
    When we switched our son from a crib to a bed, we told him to open his 
    shutters and look outside, if the sun is out he can get up, if its dark he
    has to stay in bed.  {This can be kind of early in June and July, but
    its never 5am!}   He still does this 4 years later.
    
    Rochelle

    I have a 9 1/2 month old who has been going down for bed around 6 -6:30
    p.m. and waking up at 5:15ish since she was about 6 mos. old.  I asked
    my pedi if this was a "normal" time frame and he replied to try putting
    her down later in the evening (7:30ish) to see if she won't sleep a
    little later.  Well we tried...unsuccessfully.  Come 5:00 she is up and
    raring to go.  Furthermore, I only found that waiting until 7:30ish
    only made her "past tired" and harder to get down.  We are back to
    putting her to bed around 6:30 and it is still 5:00 lately with two
    mornings of 4:00 a.m.  We also tried the morning bottle in her bed and
    on her own which was good for about 1/2 hour than it she would just be
    at a non-stop crying fit and standing in her crib.  Even when we've
    picked her up and let her play for an hour or so she doesn't want to go
    back to bed.  It sure makes for a long morning.  We would love it if
    she would sleep until 6:30-7:00.  Even on the weekends it is 5:00 a.m.
    She eventually goes down for her morning nap around 9:00.
    
    Any suggestions on how we can get her to sleep until 6:30???
    
    Toni

    re: .7
    
    I suspect that if you want to shift her "clock", you'll need to
    try to put her down later for several nights in a row before 
    you'll see much difference in her waking time.  That's how it
    usually is with our son.  
    
    FWIW, you'll want to get her shifted pretty soon because the 
    clocks will be changing in October (is that right?) and her
    5:00 will become 4:00!   Yuck!
    
    Carol

    I agree with the previous reply. In order to 'shift her clock', what 
    I'd do is to gradually adjust her bedtime. For instance, for 1 week 
    try to keep her up a little later, say 15-20 minutes, than normal. 
    The next week make it another 15-20 minutes later. So, in 2-3 weeks
    she'll hopefully be going to bed around 7:30 and getting up around
    6:30. It may take a little while to get her to shift to the times that 
    you'd like, but I think it would be alot easier than doing this all 
    at once (for you and the baby). 

    re:  .7
    
    I know exactly what you are going through.  Our daughter did this for
    months (on top of waking several times during the night).  We finally
    got her to stay up until 7:30 by adding 5 minutes a night until we
    reached 7:30.  Some nights this was extremely tough and we almost gave
    up.  What worked was walking with her, singing, reading, etc.  
    This would distract her for a few minutes and then we would try 
    something else.  Most times we were successful altho I know that on 
    a few occassions we just knew that nothing would work and we
    would put her to bed.  Then the next night we would start where we left
    off.
    
    Going to bed later helped her to sleep a little later but it wasn't the
    only thing that we had to do.  We had to make sure that not one bit of
    light came through her window.  We also made sure that her window was
    closed.  (this shouldn't be too hard since the weather is getting a bit
    cooler) Our neighbor, at about 5:30am would let
    his dog out and make a very small amount of noise which I think also
    disturbed Kaitlin's sleep.  It never bothered us, but she seemed to
    notice.  Once we did those three things, she started to sleep until
    about 6:15.  Not great but better than starting the day - especially a
    weekend - at 5:00.
    
    Now at 16 months, she stays up til about 8:15 and will sleep until 7:00
    or 7:30 on the weekends.  On weekdays she is up between 6:30 and 7:00.  
    Altho, I must say that sleeping until 7:30 has only been for about 1
    month.
    
    Good Luck!

    I wonder if she's waking at that hour because she's hungry?
    
    When AJ was about that age he woke, despite the room darkening shade
    that worked quite well.  I would give him just "a little" to drink and
    he would go back to sleep.  And considering I wasn't working at that
    point he would sometimes sleep past 9am using that method.
    
    Explore the possibly of a Hungry baby??
    
    Lyn

    GROAN ... I forgot about the clocks!!!  We spent all last winter up at
    5:00 with Jason - who usually wakes up at 6:00.  It took till about
    Feb, to get him back to 6:00.  I'm tired thinking about it!  Of course
    when we turned the clocks AHEAD, it only took a few weeks before he was
    back to 6:00 (-:  Must be his time of the morning!
    
    Sometimes, on real tired days, I'll tell him it's too early to get up,
    and tell him to come lay in bed with me.  This usually buys me about 20
    mins, at which point he's usually starving and smacking me to get up.
    
    .... just remember, some day YOU'LL be dragging THEM out of bed (I CAN
    HARDLY WAIT!!! (-:)
    
    Good Luck!! - maybe you should try going to be at 6:30 too some nights!
    
    Patty

    A couple of possibilities -- 
    
    Shorten the daytime nap(s).  
    
    Bite the bullet, go to bed early, and get up at 5:30.  We're doing
    this and after the shock to my system (I am NOT a morning person
    and I still don't LIKE it) I have to admit it's working very well.  
    Neil goes in to work early, can be home to pick up Steven at the
    bus, I'm home in the morning so whatever time the boys wake up
    isn't a problem, and I get some time to myself now that David and 
    Steven are sharing a room and David is waking up at a more
    reasonable time.  
    
    --bonnie