Conference lgp30::christian-perspective

    I already replied to this in the "other" conference but I think it's 
    important...
    
    I don't think organized prayer or Bible study should be allowed in the
    public classroom.  I also don't think organized study of other
    religions is appropriate either.  For us to maintain freedom of
    religion in this country we must insist on a true seperation of church
    and state.  This gets tricky for a lot of people who recognize that
    this country was founded by many folks who were either christians or at
    least theists.  
    
    I think we should concentrate on what is done the other 7 hours of the
    school day.  What we should be up in arms about is the lack of true
    education in academic subjects.
    
    

    
    I would be very upset if I found out that my children were being read
    the Bible in school.  I don't think it should be allowed and it
    should be my responsibility to address my children's needs as they
    arise.  For generations our parents have had the option to screw us
    up in whatever way they chose, now I want my shot at it. :-)
    
    guy

	I really don't believe that children should be tought religion
	in public schools. That is of course one reason my son does NOT
	go to a public school. I do think that children should be tought
	religion in school though. I have mixed feelings about the value
	of public schools.

	The Bible can, I think, be used legitimatly in public schools
	none the less. It must be done properly though. What is proper?
	The same use you would allow of a book from a religion that you
	do not believe in or approve of.

			Alfred

    	Another vote for "no Bible in Public Schools". There are enough
    private and religious schools about to cater to those who want their
    children to learn in a religious environment. There are also Sunday
    Schools and CCDs and Hebrew Schools and such in most communities for
    those who do not attend non-public schools. And, in most states, there
    is the option to school your children at home.
    	I went to a Parochial High School and was not scared for life by
    the experience, though I wonder about the kids attending the school
    with the "Christian Kuriculum" in Everett, Mass. 
    	I feel that the parents of that girl are justified in taking their
    plea to court. They TRIED to get the School Committee to "do the right
    thing" but were met with derision. This question has been "settled" a
    couple of times since WW II (and a couple of times before that, I
    hear). One would think that every school board has heard of Madeline
    O'Hare and her son. If not, they need to be "educated".

    I never understood why this was ever an issue.  The teaching of
    religion and sanctioned prayer has no place in public schools.  Public 
    schools ought not be in the business of endorsing as "truth" any 
    religious doctrine or concept.  The state and religion are necessarily 
    separate, fortunately, thanks to the U.S. constitution.  When public
    schools begin to teach about the Bible and conduct prayer sessions,
    then I think it CHEAPENS, and does *not* strengthen, freedom of
    religion in this country, where religions of all kinds are supposed to
    be free to flourish outside the interests of government.   Separation of 
    church and state is *not*, what some of charged, an exercise in "intolerance
    of religion."  On the contrary.  It is an exercise *in* tolerance, for if
    the government even HINTS that one religion is any better or any "more
    true" (in this case, by sanctioning prayer in public schools) than
    others, then it begins to make it more difficult for other religions -- 
    the ones not honored in the public schools -- to flourish in freedom 
    and safety.  
    
    Teaching religion in public schools is a VERY DIFFERENT thing than
    teaching ABOUT religion.  For example, if in a public school classroom,
    a teacher wanted to, in an objective way, teach ABOUT Christianity and
    teach ABOUT Islam and teach ABOUT Buddhism and teach ABOUT other
    religious/spiritual schools of thought, WITHOUT endorsing any of them
    as "truth" or implying that following any of them is the "moral" thing
    to do, then I think that is perfectly OK.  In fact, there ought to be a
    lot more lessons about religious history, concepts, and so on.
    
    I am somewhat disappointed in Mormon leadership, simply because they,
    more than anyone, should understand what religious persection is all
    about.  In their history, they were victims of some serious religious 
    persection in America.  However, Mormon prayer in public schools is 
    sanctioned out west.  I don't see any justification whatsoever for this.
    Are they forgetting their past?
    
    Paul        

    Hmmm... unless it's changed (I don't think so), school "assembly" still
    has religious flavour too it, here in England. There was some ruckus
    about insisting school prayers should remain, even in schools that
    weren't mainly christian.
    
    Pete.

    re .5
    Paul,
    	even teaching "about" religion tends to be a problem due to the
    biases involved. Did the teacher have a bad experience with a religion?
    It will show. Does a teacher have a particularly strong orientation ?
    It, too will show. Is a teacher badly informed about a religion ?  Say,
    Zoroasterism ?  Or one of the Native American options ?  It will show.
    And the students will learn what the teacher believes. And what if a
    child prefers not to believe in any God, and the parents agree. That
    child is singled out for ridicule. I think it is better to avoid the
    problem in public schools at least until the students get to college.
    UUs teach comparative religion in their Sunday Schools, most other
    religions have sources for their own, that should be enough for most
    public school kids.

Article          552
From: [email protected]
Newsgroups: clari.news.religion,clari.news.issues
Subject: Georgia selected for pilot program to teach religion in schools
Date: 9 Nov 90 11:50:18 GMT
 
 
	ATLANTA (UPI) -- Georgia has been selected for a national pilot
program to encourage public school teachers to teach about the role of
religion in the development of the United States.
	Sponsored by the non-profit First Liberty Institute, the program is
intended to correct a glaring absence of religion from most textbooks
and course syllabuses.
	``It's not expousing any religion,'' said state Superintendent Werner
Rogers. ``It's really a recognition of the fact that religion has played
a very important role in the development of our nation and continues to
today ... How can you teach American history without teaching that
people came here to achieve religious freedom.''
	First Liberty, an outgrowth of the commission headed by former
Supreme Court Chief Justice Warren Berger to celebrate the bicentennial
of the Constitution, views the teacher training program as way to have
lasting impact on how schools teach civic values, particularly freedom
of religion.
	Parents, state school board members and First Liberty officials
contend that teachers shy away from discussing religon at all because
they fear reprisals for promoting it at school.
	Because they are afraid to mention God, some textbooks indicate the
first Thanksgiving was a time for the Pilgrims to thank the Indians for
corn, rather than to thank God for their survival. Many history books
also omit any mention of black churches' role in the civil rights
movement.
	Charles Haynes, president of the National Council on Religion and
Public Education, said teacher fear about discussing religion is denying
U.S. students a proper understanding of American history.
	Haynes said students need to learn that freedom of conscience is an
essential and inalienable American right.
	First Liberty selected Georgia for the national pilot program after
Rogers expressed interest two years ago. The state Board of Education
agreed to the plan Thursday on an 8-1 vote.
	Board member Juanita Baranco cast the lone dissenting vote, saying
teaching about religion and religious liberty is a ``highly sensitive''
move that should be executed with ``absolute caution.''
	Participation in the program by the state's 185 school systems will
be voluntary.

    
    Here is my 2 cents worth...
    
    I feel that PARENTS and NOT teachers must provide children with a
    moral foundation and a knowledge of the Lord and His ways. In a public
    school ALL faiths may be represented. I think it would be impossible
    for a teacher to provide information of a religious nature without
    coloring that information with their own life experience and beliefs.
    
    This same reasoning also applies to prayer in schools. Asking part of a
    class to leave if they do not wish to, or are offended by, prayer is
    unfair and may subject them to ridicule, particularly if they are a
    small minority (children can be very cruel to anyone who is the least
    bit different). Additionally, time in school is too precious to waste!!
    
    In conclusion, I want my children to know and love the Lord. As a
    parent, this is MY task and it is MY JOY to do it!!

    	In Communist Poland it was difficult to be a practicing Christian
    as it was technically illegal. The laws banning religion were seldom
    enforced, especially against Catholics, but they were on the books. 
    	When Poland threw out the Communist government it allowed that
    priests should be allowed to teach an elective course in religion in
    all public schools. Reports suggest that the courses have not been
    popular and that many parents sign their children up but few of the
    children regularly attend.
    	There is a section of the new Polish Constitution, not yet
    ratified, which would make attendence at such courses MANDATORY for ALL
    children; Jews, Protestants, Catholics, Orthodox Christians, agnostics
    and athiests alike. 
    	Most Poles older than I were raised as God-fearing Catholics and
    this strong minority is much in favor of that part of the proposed
    Constitution. Younger Poles have come to resent the Black Crows that
    seem intent on replacing the Reds as the dictators of their country.

    
    
    
    	Tyranny, no matter how well intended, is still tyranny!