Conference 7.286::atarist

     Hi 
    
    I can get the SCSI ANSI spec, (its in our tech library). Its quite
    heavy going. Mail me if you need a print.
    
    Pat K.

    Re: .0
    
    [Hard disk problems with Supra adaptor, Mac disks, Spectre 128]
    
    Okay. I assume your setup looks something like this:
    
           +-------------------+
    	   |        ST         |
           +-------------------+
              "
              "  DMA
              "
          +-------+  SCSI   +------------+  SCSI   +------------+
          | Supra |<=======>| Supra SCSI |<=======>| Mac SCSI   |
          |Adaptor|         | disk drive |         | disk drive |
          +-------+         +------------+         +------------+
    
    Where do you have SCSI termination resistor packs installed?
    
    You say the Mac drive was formatted on a Mac II; what software did you
    use on the Mac? Dave Small mentioned moving winchester disks directly
    between Macs and STs running Spectre, but I don't remember the details 
    because I don't do things that way.
    
    Have you run Dave Small's 'Mac disk finder' directly from the GEM
    desktop? The version that comes with the Magic Sac will tell you all
    the Sac/Mac disks on your DMA line.
    
    I assume there's a reason why you're not using Dave Small's emulated
    Mac disk formatter on the ST... 
    				- hbm

    Re: .1
    
    Pat,
       Thanks for the offer. I've located a copy of the ANSI SCSI spec
    locally.
    
    Re: .2
    
    Yes, the hardware layout is as you said - both drives are terminated.
    
    I started out formatting the MAC drive on the Atari and trying to
    convert one of the partitions to Spectre format but the partition would
    never change. Poking around with a sector editor I found that the
    volume information block, which should have been written on logical
    sector 3 was actually written on logical sector 17 (I've already
    reported this problem to Dave Small and he has no idea whats going on).
    Given this problem I decided that the best way to go was to dedicate
    the entire disk to the Spectre and format it directly on a MAC. I've
    actually done this a couple of times; first with the standard Apple
    SCSI HD Setup program and then with the formatter supplied by Rodime.
    In both cases the drive worked great on the MAC but the Atari cannot
    "see" the drive at all!
    
    John.
    

    Re: .3
    
    [Drive termination]
    
    Both drives should *not* be terminated! Only one drive should be, and
    it is my experience that the drive closest to the adaptor is the one to
    terminate.
    					- hbm

	
	From what I remember of SCSI, I believe the far ends of the
	cable should be terminated.  That is, at the adapter and at the
	farthest drive.  Definately both drives should NOT be terminated.

	chris

    Re: .4, .5
    
    I'll try playing around with the terminators tonight. That may well be
    the problem since I remember something about the MACs not being
    terminated at the CPU end of the SCSI chain.
    
    John.

    I tried all possible combinations of terminators in and out on both
    drives. One combination did produce some results; terminators in on the
    Supra and out on the MAC drive. This would allow me to read a few
    sectors from the drive before it stopped responding and I would have to
    cycle the power. Eventually even this partial operation stopped
    working. Obviously there is some sort of termination problem but
    there's some other problem as well.
    
    John.

    I talked to Supra technical support and they offered to look at the
    problem for no charge (other than shipping costs). So both disks are on
    their way out to Oregon.
    
    John.

I'm sure I have something set wrong, I just don't know what it is...

I've installed a Supra 40MB hard disk on my system, and now boot off of that
(drive c:). My problem is that when I turn on the system, drive a is checked
first, and then the boot off of c: is performed. The problem is that drive a:
keeps on running until I put a disk in it. If the disk is in it when the system
is turned on, it boots from there. How can I have it boot from c: but turn off
a:?

Steve

>I've installed a Supra 40MB hard disk on my system, and now boot off of that

>If the disk is in it when the system is turned
>on, it boots from there. How can I have it boot from c: but turn off a:?
Try using a newly formated floppy disk in drive a:.  The affect you describe
can be caused by floppy disks which contain boot code (ie: commercial game
disks).

	Ray

If the supra drive is not ready when the ST comes up (always true if
you power them up at the same time), it will boot from floppy instead. 
This is particularly bad with TOS 1.0.  It gets somewhat better with TOS
1.4 (has to to work with Stacy, which has one power switch), but in some
form, this problem carries through TOS 1.62.  Power up the hard drive
first, wait for it to stop singing, and then turn on the CPU unit, and
it should boot okay every time.

The floppy light remaining on is a characteristic of all TOS versions. 
Always keep a blank disk in the drive to shut it off at boot time.

>> Power up the hard drive
>> first, wait for it to stop singing, and then turn on the CPU unit, and
>> it should boot okay every time.

I use a little piece of SW in an AUTO folder on a floppy disk, which just
waits some seconds until the harddisk is up and then resets the CPU to boot
quite normal from drive C:. The program is called "ugly duck" or something
like that and is available on the archive server.

-Hans

Thanks for the replies. I had come up with the same fix. I used to switch 
everything on at once from a power strip, now I power off the Atari and let the
drive spin up before powering up and that works. I'll also keep blank disks in 
the floppy drive. I had one instance the other day where the b: floppy spun up
and nothing shut it down, short of powering down. (I gave it a floppy and it
still wouldn't shut up, I soft booted and it just kept going, and going, until
I powered it off).

I'll check out the delay software also.

Steve

>
>I use a little piece of SW in an AUTO folder on a floppy disk, which just
>waits some seconds until the harddisk is up and then resets the CPU to boot
>quite normal from drive C:. The program is called "ugly duck" or something
>like that and is available on the archive server.
>

	I found this software to be pretty unreliable.  It would work just
	fine for a while, then wouldn't work at all.  After a while it
	might start working again.  Probably something funny in my setup
	but I could never figure out.  In any case, I found another
	similar program called TIMER.ACC somewhere that has worked out
	much better for me.  Leave it on a floppy in the A drive and the
	system will reboot every n seconds until the HD is ready.  I don't
	think the time interval is settable.  This can be found at

	SOLVIT::USER$13:[LANDRY.ST.PUBLIC]TIMER.ACC

	chris

    Sounds great!
    
    I tried copying it, and VMS complained of an inappropriate device type.
    
    Is there a mistake?
    
    Gil Steil

	Sorry, I put in a $ that didn't belong there!  Try this:

	SOLVIT::USER13:[LANDRY.ST.PUBLIC]TIMER.ACC

	chris