Conference misery::feline_v1

    Hi Ros,
    
    I definitely know what you are going through.  My dog Keisha is failing
    very rapidly.  Six months ago I was ready to make the ultimate trip to
    the vets.  They told me to try pain killers.  It worked - for a while.
    Now she is going downhill again.
    
    She is doing things that are upsetting and I do want to remember her in
    a good way.
    
    It's a shame to have a vet that is not as understanding as some of the
    ones that you read about here.  I feel the vet should have sat you and
    your SO down and explained everything to you right away.  Dropping a
    bomb is not my idea helping you make any decisions.
    
    I am also going through this with Black Thunder (read BLACK THUNDER
    GOES TO COLLEGE).  I love my animals very much and I can tell that you
    love yours just as much.
    
    I didn't mind reading about Starky here in Felines.  A lot of us
    Feliners have both dogs and cats and love them equally.
    
    I'm sorry that Starky might have to lose a leg at so young an age but
    hopefully he still will have a good life with you.  My motto is 
    
    		ONWARD AND UPWARD ---- THINK POSITIVE
    
    Hang in there, we definitely are here to support you, right gang???
    
    Keep us posted......
    
    Sandi (mom to Lightning, DejaVu, Thunder & Keisha)
    
    
    

    Can you get in touch with your "real" vet?  It is bad enough to
    have an animal in trouble without having a vet you can't trust.  If
    yur real vet is inaccessible for some time, perhaps you could take your
    dog's medical records, xrays to a good vet near you that someone
    in this file could recommend. Meanwhile, I think Teddy Kennedy's son
    had the type of cancer your dog has, and he seems to be doing fine 
    years later after his leg was amputated.  There have been
    several stories in this file about three-legged cats managing
    very well.  Please let us know what is happening.
    
    

    Roslyn,
    
    Hang in there kid.  We will help you through this.  I think that
    the way the vet handled this was awful.  So much for bedside manner.
    I changed vets recently cause I wasn't comfortable with the new
    vet my vet hired to help out.  I just kept ending up with him on
    emergencies and didn't like him.  Now I go to an office with two
    vets that I like.
    
    I hope that your vet gets back real soon and you get some straight
    answers.  It seems to me that if this is cancer, then time is of
    the essence.  You may want to take your dogs records and x-rays
    and take him up to Tufts or another veterinary teaching hospital.
    They are usually up on the newest methods of treating diseases,
    and they would certainly treat you better than you have been so
    far.
    
    Jo

    Roslyn,
      You might draft up a letter of complaint and send it to the
    ?director? of the hospital - or whomever is the highest ranking
    administrator.  Also copy Dr Kaplan in and your regular vet.
    That ought to get some action.  If it doesn't and you want to
    pursue if further, put an editorial in your local paper.
    
      You deserve much better treatment than that.  How someone can
    get to be an experienced vet and fail to understand the bond
    between dogs or cats and their humans is beyond me.  Too bad
    "compassion" isn't a required course at the vet. schools.
      Good luck and hang in there.  There's a good chance things
    will all work out.  We'll be thinking of you.
        Nancy DC
    

    Hi Roslyn,
    
         Ditto all the good suggestions, especially the one about Tufts.
    They are truly marvelous there; they did surgery on our wild pheasant
    so that she would be able to see again.  And needless to say they are
    taking care of all of our boys, especially because of the FIP titers
    (which went down last month!  Yay!!!).
    
         If there's anything I can do, please let me know.  Hang in there
    and we're all pulling for you!
    
                                        - Andrea
    

    
    Roslyn,
    
    	Definitely ditto on Tufts.  They are MARVELOUS!!!!!!  I can't say
    enough about the vets there.  They treat the animals better than most
    people get treated in a hospital.
    
    	I had to take my Snowball there late one night for an emergency
    C-Section.  That's a story in itself.  They were wonderful, first over
    the phone and then through the whole thing.  The C-Section was done at
    midnight and about 1 am the surgeon called me at home to let me know
    that Snowball and babies came through surgery fine.  The next morning
    when I got to work I had a message waiting from Tufts.  The first part
    was that Snowball ate all her breakfast and was adjusting wonderfully
    to motherhood.  The rest of the message was to call so we could come
    get her and the kittens.
    
    	Tufts can be expensive but I really feel they are worth it.  It
    cost over $600 for Snowball's C-Section.  They have a payment plan
    and seem to do whatever is necessary to treat the animal and still
    get paid in a way convenient to the owners.
    
    	I hope your puppy does okay.  Like the others said, keep us
    posted.  We care.
    
    Faith
    

    At the risk of sounding stupid - where is Tufts located?
    Boston?  We're in Braintree.
    

    I too hope your puppy does okay. I also would try Tufts- while they
    are expensive, they are also good. Also- is this the same Dr. Kaplan
    who is somewhere around Concord or Acton? I may have read it in
    your note- but is your pup by chance a Wolfhound? Just wondering
    because Irish Wolfhounds are SO loveable but are prone to having
    tumors early in life.
     
    About three-legged dogs, they can do quite well. In fact we had
    a dog with three legs- he started out with 4, but got into a dog
    fight with a MUCH larger dog and ended up with only 1 leg in the
    front (our dog was a cocker spaniel x ). Anyway, we lived on
    the 2nd floor at the time and for months after the dog came home 
    my mother always carried Nippy up and down the stairs. Then one day 
    she saw me bringing him in on a leash and the dog was walking up the 
    stairs on his own (it was sort of a hop). She asked me how long 
    he had been doing that and I told her that he'd
    been doing it almost from the beginning (I was only about 10 years
    old). After that she never carried him again up/down the stairs. 
    He did so well - walking, climbing. Just amazing - but animals
    compensate. Since then I have seen several
    3-legged dogs, - some with a full leg missing in the back, some
    with one missing in the front.
    
    But do try another vet - even if it just for consultation. If the
    cancer is confined to his leg, then he could do okay with three
    legs.
    
    FWIW- My dog has a form of mouth cancer. It's a cancer that won't
    spread to other parts of the body, but is localized in the mouth.
    It appeared a couple years ago- but the bottom line is - she is
    doing great! No pain - but we treat it as needed, and she is expected
    to be with us for a long time to come. I guess what
    I am getting at is- because a dog has cancer does not necessarily
    mean things are over for him. Properly treated, the cancer can
    be eliminated entirely or controlled, and the dog can lead a happy
    long life. Your puppy could be with you for YEARS to come.
    And if it means with only three legs - then he'll do it and he'll
    do it well.
    
    I apologe for ramblin' on, I just hope for the best for you pet; and
    I want your spirits to be high. The vet's behavior was inexcusable
    but hopefully you can get someone at Tufts (or at another animal
    hospital) to give you the help you deserve.
    Pat                                       
     

    Nancy, Tufts is on Route 30 in North Grafton.  I know that probably
    doesn't help so if you want specifics, let me know and I'll send
    directions off-line.
    
    Roslyn, you might want to give them a call in regards to your dog's
    condition.  As Andrea stated, they are expensive and require money
    up-front but their staff is superb and highly skilled.  If I had
    any indication that Shelby's condition was so serious, I would 
    have taken him there.  Next time, I will know better.
    
    Good luck.  We're here for you.
    
    
    /Roberta
    

    Hi,
    
    I too am really sorry to hear about Sparky.  We went through a similar
    situation with vets recently with our dog Zowie.  She was in terrible
    pain and our normal vet kept telling us she was just getting old.  We
    finally took her to a specialist, who diagnosed her as having an
    autoimmune disease, put her on steroids, and she's fine.  But the vet's 
    attitude cost us several weeks in false leads, and his nasty attitude
    cost me some tears, fearing that we'd have to put her to sleep.  Sigh.
    
    As for bone cancer...  The breeder of our other dog has a dog with
    bone cancer.  They recently amputated one of her front legs to get
    rid of it.  Darkness (the dog with cancer) is one of the all-time
    best lure coursing borzoi in America, so she loves to run.  Even
    on three legs she runs as much as she ever did, and hardly seems
    to miss it!  
    
    My understanding is that bone cancer can come in one of two forms.
    First, if it's "just" bone cancer, once the affected area is 
    eliminated (amputated) there should be no further problems.  It's
    a slow growing type and is very unlikely to have spread.  The 
    other way that I know of is to have another cancer which has 
    spread to the bone, but it sounds like Sparky has the first kind,
    since they didn't find other cancer.
    
    Best of luck, and please try to talk to a vet you can trust.  Our
    thoughts will be with you.
    
    Karen.

    re: .9  N Grafton.  Well that's way too far out for us folks on
    the south shore but thanks anyway.
    

    What about angell memorial Hospital in Boston?  Does anyone have any
    experience with them?  I know they are a large animal hospital, and
    quite well-known.  Are they good?
    

    
    Re. Tufts.
    
    If it is too far to travel, I might suggest a phone call for a
    recommendation.
    
    It is a bit of a distance from the South Shore.  The one thing that
    might make it worth whiled is that it is not very far from RTE495 and
    from where the Mass Pike intersects 495.  From say the Dedham area it
    isn't more than an hour.  I don't know where you are located so this is
    just a little more detail on Tufts.
    
    Good luck.
    Faith
    

    RE:  Angell Memorial
    
    You couldn't do much better than Angell for tough cases in the 
    Boston Area, They are also expensive and will require up front money
    but they have all the specialists and your pet won't get better
    care anywhere.  They will also consult with a specialist at Tufts
    (Which is a teaching Hospital and VERY advanced and almost brand
    New) if necessary.  So if you are handy to Angell (which is run
    by the S P C A as  is Rowley Memorial in Springfield Ma.) you should
    take advantage of it!!
    
    I'm so sorry to hear about your Puppy.  Vet's likt that one should
    be in research, they don't belong to the compassionate world of
    pets and owners.  It's a shame that you were so badly treated.
    
    By the way, if you are going to get a second opinion, please don't
    wait too long, if surgery is indicated time could be of the essence.
    
    Please keep us posted, we care about you both and Sparky too!
    
    Feline Canine,
    
    Sue & Panther (who likes to play with dogs) & Spot (who doesn't
    :-} )
    

    re:  A. M.
    
    They are wonderful - as far back as I can remember, my Mom
    took our dogs and cats there - we lived in Malden MA and 
    took them in to town (Boston) to Angel - Excellent place.

re: cancer in dog's leg

I had this with my lady Tara.  I was referred to a cancer/bone specialist
vet and we subsequently amputated Tara's front leg and went through 6 months
of chemotherapy.  She lived 2.5 years after the therapy and died from a
metasisized cancer in her chest - once discovered, I put her down.  My
experiences are:

	The cancer is expensive to treat (here in Cal, I paid over
	$800.00 for the surgery - $80.00/treatment of chemo).
	This was 6 - 7 years ago....It would be very expensive now.

	It did buy us time, but she died from cancer, so I feel it was
	NOT eliminated by amputation.  If she had been younger, it
	would have meant a severely reduced life span for Tara; as it
	was, she lived to be 9.5...I feel she would have lived to 13 or
	more if healthy.

	I was happy to see that the chemo did not make her terribly
	ill as it does in humans - she was rocky for about 24 hours
	after and then fine until the next chemo.  Tara was a large
	dog (shepard/lab mix) so it may be different for smaller dogs.

	A regular vet doesn't know how to treat cancer....you need a
	specialist and you need one fast!  Maybe the treatments are
	better these days, but delay will cost you your dog's life
	for sure.

Would I go through it again?  I'm not sure....every day was precious,
but there were not enough of them to make me feel I was justified in
what I put the poor girl through - she hated that ride for chemo (1 hour
once a week - stay all day - home again in 1 hour)...and she hurt alot
at the end..Find a good vet and get referred to a vet oncologist and
ask some real painful questions and make up your own mind.

		I hope you're lucky!

    re: Angell Memorial
    
    I personally have only had a few experiences with them and for 
    routine things like shots and spaying.  (Mao was spayed free by
    them as she came from the Boston Animal Shelter).  I did have
    friends, however, who hated Angell Memorial and felt AM was 
    responsible for the death of their dog.  They are the ones who
    pointed me at my current vet who is excellent.  At the time
    I was living in Dorchester so I much preferred a vet who was
    within a mile of my home to driving to Jamacia Plain in the
    event of an emergency.
    
      Basically, the story they told me was, their dog was injured
    and they took him to AM for emergency treatment.  They left the
    dog with them and left them their Mastercard number and left
    instructions to do whatever was necessary for the dog.  The
    dog took a turn for the worse and emergency surgery was re-
    quired.  Even tho Marcia had already signed forms saying she
    would take responsibility and pay whatever expenses, AM didn't
    operate.  They tried to contact her for consent.   There were
    problems with her phone and they couldn't call her.  To AM's
    credit, they sent someone to her apartment, by car, to get 
    consent.  Well, by the time they went through all this, the
    dog had died.
      Needless to say Marcia was extreemly upset and absolutely
    BullS&*t with AM and blamed them for the dog's death.  Now
    this says nothing about their medical abilities, but it was
    enough to warn me away from them for emergency situations.
    At this point, I think I'd be willing to use them if that's
    what my vet recommended, but I'd be very sure that they
    knew to do EVERYTHING necessary.
    
    I just wanted to relate that one story - more as a "be careful"
    than as a mark against Angell Memorial.
      Nancy DC

    The reason I raised a question about angell memorial is that a number
    of years ago I took my parakeet to them when he was in respiratory
    distress.  They released him to me a few days later, saying he was
    okay, and the following day at home, he died.  I don't know if this
    is an isolated incident or not.  I know parakeets are very vulnerable
    to pneumonia, etc., so I don't know how much blame to attach to 
    angell memorial.
    

    I used to take our pet ducks to Angell- Dr. Petrak. I was quite
    pleased with them, but I think the trips are very stressful to birds. 
    I was lucky in that my ducks were a pair of  hardy ole' critters.
    
    What about the South Shore Animal Hospital? Aren't they supposed
    to be quite good? Never used them tho- I live too far away.
    Pat
    

    re: South Shore - We dropped in there one day just after we took
    in Melynda & Tymothee to see if they offered any kind of low cost
    spay.  They didn't - the price was $100 - but the facility looked
    good and it was very busy.   I'll have to check around some more.
    

    what has happened so far to Stark? How's is he doing? And-
    how are YOU doing?
    Pat
    

    Please keep us posted, we really care about you and Stark.
    We know that it is hard to remember when so much is going on, but
    a quick note would be most welcome!
    
    Feline Anxious,
    
    Sue & Panther & Spot
    

     
    
    Hi gang,
    
    Sorry to be out of touch for so long.  I've been out of notes for
    months and have just started to catch up.  We got extremely busy 
    taking Stark to two different vets but the outcome was the same.  
    At the beginning of August Stark was put to sleep.
    
    The prognosis was the same from all of the vets.  Tufts said that it
    was a very aggressive form of cancer.  It's rare that this type is seen
    in animals this young but it has been seen in a puppy as young as three
    months.  It grows in the marrow and works its way out.  It was not the
    type that would spread through the leg but would eventually weaken the
    leg enough to snap it when pressure was applied.  The cancer would also
    show up later in the liver and lungs.  They gave him 6-9 months maybe a
    year.  Amputating the leg would only save it from breaking and not give
    him any additional time.
    
    Chris and I couldn't see putting Stark through the trauma of losing his
    leg only to lose his life a few months down the road.  We decided to
    make the best out of his remaining time.  Chris took him camping in
    Maine for about a week.  The only thing that really hurts is Chris put
    Stark to sleep after he had a bad night.  I wasn't home and never got
    to say good-bye to him.  I hadn't seen Stark since the night before
    Chris decided to take him to Maine. He called to say that they were
    leaving and would be back Sunday.  When I got home Sunday evening,
    Stark was gone and buried.  I sort of feel cheated. I also feel good
    knowing that Stark never did suffer.
    
    Stark was a good buddy and friend.  He had a large warm spirit though
    he acted alot like Odie from Garfield.  The kitties miss him almost as
    much as we do.  They still look to see if he's going to join in the
    catch-me-if-you-can-game.  Once in a great while I feel as though
    Stark's spirit comes back for a visit.  I don't thinks it's wishful
    thinking since the cats seem to notice it too.  Stark is missed by all
    of us and I know that one day we will have dogs again.  But for now
    Chris and I have decided to wait until we can buy a house.  It's
    harder to move around with a horse, two cats and dogs.
    
    Thank you all for your concern, support and encouragement!  I showed
    Chris the early responses and we were both very touched by them.  Sorry
    it has taken so long to get back to you all.
    
    Love,
    
    Roslyn, Chris, Escho, Brandy and Cheyenne

    Stark will be commemorated with this quarter's Silver LIning
    Memorial Awards.  I hope this offers some small condolence.
      Nancy DC

    I'm very sorry about Stark.
    

    
    Thanks for your caring, concern and support.  Chris and I really
    appreciated it.  There are times we really miss Stark but I know that
    eventually we'll get another puppy.  There are times I could swear I
    feel Stark's presence near me.  Sort of like he's back for a visit and
    to let me know he's okay.
    
    We're hanging tough.  Again, THANK YOU all!
    
    Rosly, Chris, Escho, Brandy and Cheyenne