Conference napalm::heavy_metal

    Winger open for the Scorpions this Friday in Denver. I'll give a
    concert review on Monday.
    
    
    the devil dog who can't wait for the Scorps!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    I've seen one of their videos on MTV not long ago.  I thought it
    was a good song.  I'd like to hear more of their stuff (not sure
    if I want to cough up for the album yet though).
    
    gh

    
    
    I Have to agree with the earlier stated statement where as of the
    speaking of the new WINGER album. I thought it was really good.
    Madelaine, the first single and video off the album is also really
    good.
    
                                                Two cents from Tempe
                                                         
                                                          Tom
    
    
    
    

    I have the video to the single Madelaine, which is what led me to
    buy the album. If you like the single, you'll like the album, in
    this case it is as easy as that.
    
    Prince Of The Dawn.
    
    

    
    
    	from Metal Edge...
    
    	Back in Denver, CO Kip Winger went out with "a slimy
    	b*tch that dragged my head through the mud for two	
    	years.  Now I got my revenge," he smiles.  ...
    
    	Well, well, well...
    
    	Tig~~
    

    Anyone (other than Tom) heard the whole album?  It seems to be selling
    well.  What's it like?
    
    gh

    I have the album and i have only played it a few times but it is
    a powerfull AOR orientated album. Madalaine is brilliant, but is
    by no means the only good song.
    
    When i have listened to it a bit more i'll comment on the others,
    the 9 others anyway.
    
    Jaberwocky.

    re tig   Where did you hear that? I was at that Denver show. 

    
    
    
    	Jesse.
    
    	All the article said was that Kip Winger used to
    	go out with a girl in Denver...
    
    	Tig~~
    

    
    Re. last few
    
           The day of the concert while driving home, KILO was inter-
    viewing that guy (Kip?). Anyway at the end of the interview he said
    his Mom and Dad and other family were going to be at the show. Then
    he added that he hoped that the real Madelain (Sp?) would be at
    the show and told the story of going out with this girl for about
    2 years in Denver. He said it was a real bad relationship that he
    had to break away from. He said he hoped she would be there and
    that he would see her now with an armfull of kids. He seemed like
    a real down to earth guy.
                                mike
    

    I just got a loan of the Winger tape and altho' I liked a few songs
    I wasn't all that impressed. I am no great Thrash fan, but, I found
    the tape too soft for my personal taste. A bit like Bon Jovi without
    the over exposure.		
    					BONZO.

    Saw a Winger vid on MTV, not sure of the tune 'tho, it sounded pretty
    good. Missed them when the opened for the Scorps, too much root
    beer on the trip to Denver.
    
    jh

    I saw them performing on MTVs Mouth to Mouth talk show a couple
    of weeks back and thought they sounded really good.  It sounded
    live, cause they jammed a bit, so I don't think it was a (nasty)
    lip synch.  BTW, the song they did wasn't one of the ones I've seen
    a video for and seemed a lot harder.
    
    gh

    I also recently aquired this LP (Thanx Scary!)
    
    I think it's the gnads... A cross between BonJovi/Dokken/Tesla...
    Two out of three of my fav bands.  I'd suggest this album for who
    ever is into posuer/glam/commercial metal...
    
    jc (Who sez WINGER is cool)

    
    		my .02 worth..
    
    i got the tape last week.. i would give it a 7..
    
    i like the music, but i think the lyrics s~c..
    
    
    			wendy o'
    

    Yo GH,
    
    You saw Winger on saturday, right?!?
    
    How bout a review?  I'd like to esp. hear how Reb Beach was, he's
    an up-and-coming guitar fav of moi.
    
    Buck

    I saw Winger in concert Sat. night and thought I'd post a review...
                                   
    It was at a (relatively) small club here in Co. Springs.  The place was
    packed out.  The show opened up with a three piece band from
    Brownsville Texas called Bad Habit.  I mention them because they were
    HOT!  They played mostly originals, but did some Rush (picture
    perfect!), Pink Floyd, and Jethro Tull.  Personally, I liked their
    originals the best, they had a harder edge.  Kind of like Rush, but
    more guitar based. They are supposedly getting a recording together, so
    if ya get a chance to check 'em out, by all means do! 
    
    Winger was a bit of a surprise.  Like a lot of people here, I thought
    they were just a studio band, but was I shocked!  They played VERY
    well.  They had a great sound (good tone, good mix) and were quite
    tight.  Kip Winger has an outstanding amount of stage presence. He
    definately makes the show (looks good too, even up close. I'm surprised
    that some of you girls havn't mentioned drooling over him).  Reb Beach
    played confidently and consistantly, as did the other guitar/keyboard
    player, Paul (sorry, I don't remember his name). Rod Morgenstein(sp),
    the drummer, was EXCELLENT!  I don't usually get off on drum solos, but
    his was tasteful (and not so long as to get boring).  I expected a lot
    from him, as he used to play with the Dregs which were quite
    progressive (but not metal), and wasn't disappointed a bit. 
    
    The entire band seemed like they were enjoying playing and conveyed a
    lot of energy to the audience.  This is one of the things that I like
    best in a live band!!!  It's one of the main reasons I liked old Van
    Halen, because they always acted like they were having a good time (and
    sent this message to the audience!).  Winger was excellent in this
    respect. 
                                   
    For you musicians/equip. freaks; Reb played a Kramer w/EMG pickups and
    Paul an Ibanez (looked like a RG550, but probably was custom, I don't
    remember a model with just one pickup).  They both played through Kitty
    Hawk amps (which sounded great).  Rod played a Premier double bass
    setup (which also sounded killer).  Kip played a Spector bass (I don't
    remember who makes these).  I couldn't identify a specific amp which he
    was using, so he might have either gone direct into the PA or used one
    of a number of Kitty Hawk amps/cabinets which lined the stage. 
    
    So overall, the playing was precise and well executed, they had lots of
    energy and a great sound mix, and seemed like they were had a good
    time.  I know I did.  I'd recommend that anyone into well played high
    energy commercial rock check 'em out.  The live show is BETTER than the
    album, which I also thought was very good. 
    
    gh 
                                              

    I've made the effort to listen to this album on numerous occasions.
    
    I must admit that I may have been a bit to quick to put the band
    down. I really like two tracks in particular. One I think was 
    Only 17 and the other State of Emergency. The only thing I did not
    like was the cover of Hendrix's Purple Haze.
    
    Bonzo.

    Kips comment before they played "Purple Haze" (about the 2nd or
    3rd song in the set) was "A lot of people thought we were crazy
    to do this song.  Let's see how crazy you think we were."  It went
    over REAL well.  In case you didn't notice, on the album Dweezil
    Zappa played with them on that one, he's credited with the solo.
    
    Perhaps this was just an on night, but they sounded great.  They
    seemed really psyched!
    
    An interesting (and yet useless) bit of information on "State of
    Emergency";  I was on pager when I first heard that song and I thought
    for sure that my pager was going off at one point in it.  There
    is a sound in there that's almost exactly like our pagers...scared
    the crap outta me.
    
    gh

    re .26 
    
    I was doing about 85 mph on the Motorway when State of Emergency
    was playing. It ain't funny coz when you reach down to switch off
    your pager at that speed and discover that the damn thing ain't
    there coz it's Saturday, well all I can say is the Racing Stripes
    were almost apon me.
    
    
    Bonzo.

    I was wondering about that cuz on New Years Eve, I saw them on MTV,
    and it was obviously live.  They sounded hot.  They played 4-5 of
    their faves and like GH said, they were having a GREAT time.
    
    jc

Well, I went to the Channel, but it was sold out (I can't believe it - I
thought the place would be empty!). How was the show? 

cat

    
    
    Oh ya Pete, Winger also played bass w/Aldo Nova a couple of times
    too.
    
    
    
    

    RE .COOK
    THOUGHT U KNEW THAT..
    
    you'd never know it, watching watching him up on stage..
    
    
    
    SHOW WAS INCRED. AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
                           
    (right sue)??
    
    
    
    	U GUYS MISSED A GOOD SHOW..
    
    sounds great studio and live..
    
    
    	so there!
    

    
    
    	Yes RIGHT ! It was AWESOME! Nice view~!!!!!!!!!
    	Hated the cage though! BlaH...
    
    
    	SueJ

    I just saw the Winger Video for Seventeen!
    
    IMHO Kip Winger is no more than a poor imitation of Dave Lee Roth
    as far as showmanship goes. Now I wonder how many of the Female
    members of this conf. are gonna kill me.
    
    
    Bonzo. ;')

    
    
    Well I don't like Winger..  but I just remembered something my brother
    told me..
    
    He said her heard that Winger used to play bass for Alice Cooper
    a loooooong time ago.
    
    And he wrote "17" because he wrote "18".. I said that doesn't make
    too much sense because one of the songs has a meaning, and Wingers
    doesn't.. but he said yup, he played for Alice.
    
    Any truth to this?
    
    F.

    Yes He was the Bass player,,Not sure on what Album tho
    
    
    
    
    

    
    
    	RE: Drummer being awesome
    
    	Yea!!  And he's cute, too!!  He reminds me alot of the 
    	Eddie Van Halen look.  Just put a dumb, yet cute smile
    	on your face and you're all set!  (8
    
    	But...as far as Winger's concerned, I like the band anyway
    	and I must agree with Pete.  They were GREAT!!  Now,
    	the Bulletboys on the other hand....
    
    	If they could get rid of Marq Tourine (sp?), maybe they'd
    	have a chance, but I don't want to stray from the topic,
    	so I'll leave it at the fact that Winger was AWESOME!!
    
    	And Kip is looking as fine as ever!!  (8
    
    	Tigga~~  Who's back from FLA!
    

    I don't want to start another big p*ss about sexual preference, so
    please don't start talking about it or bashing me for being prejudiced,
    because this is not my intention in asking this.
    
    My wife was saying she heard that Kip Winger was gay (she thought on
    MTV).  I told her that I didn't believe it.
    
    Not that it really matters, but I'm curious.  Does anyone know?
    
    gh

    Well, I had heard the same rumor from a few contacts I have in NYC.
    Either way it doesn't really matter, does it?
    
    Buck, not saying much after the JP note

    
    
    	Well, if he is I'm sure his girlfriend, Shaloma (I think
    	that's how it's spelled) is a tad upset.  Tigg, you still
    	have the mag with their pic in it?                 

    
    
    	JJ...I'm sure I still have it kicking around somewhere
    	in that blizzard I call a bedroom (8
    
    	But last I heard, he and his girlfriend had broken up.
    	But I haven't heard he was gay...
    
    	Tigga~~

    re: .47      Either way it doesn't really matter, does it?
    
    No, it doesn't matter.  I tried to make that clear in my original note
    to avoid the kind of thing that happened in the Judas Priest note.  I
    was just curious.  
    
    If I asked what his favorite food was, nobody would care, but if I ask
    what his sexual preference is, it causes a big stink.  I wish people
    wouldn't be so sensative about this sort of thing.
    
    gh

     Does anybody know Kip Winger's REAL name?
    
    
    B.A.

    
    agagagaga !!

    
    
    	re: -1 & -2    :-P   ppfftthh!!
    
    	
    	What makes you think that isn't his real name??
    
    

    
    Kip ? as in Kipper as in fish ?? as in scaley, smelly big-a$$ lips...
    
    Yeah - you're right - could be his real name !!!!

    
    
    	Tony!!
    
    	You are such a sh*t!!
    

    
    
    WIONGER IS HIS REAL LAST NAME, KIP? I GUESS IS A NICK NAME..
    
    AL STARR WOULD KNOW....
    
    
    				;^)
    
    		WENDY O'
    

    
    	On 'Constrictor' it's listed as Wringer, and on 'Raise your Fist'
    
    it's spelt Winger.
    
    	Who knows...mistake?  Misspelling?  Name change?  Drugs?
    
    
    						Les
    

>    AL STARR WOULD KNOW....

Actually, when I met him (prior to the release of the album - he was in town
for a promotional visit), he was going by the name Kip Winger. I don't know
what his 'real' name is, and if it is the same or different.....

cat

    
    It could be "Kip Wank*r" !!! 8^) ;^)
    
    BTW - JJ Loves me really !! 8^)

    
    
    	Yeah, well I guess so..... :-)
    
    	hee hee
    
    	(BTW- you're getting worse!! )
    

                Whatever  it   is,  it's  better  than  some  guy
                claiming his real  name  is  Sebastian  Bach!!  I
                heard that one last  night.    Who  does he think
                he's kidding :').  With  his  musical ability, he
                should be named Honky Tonk Man.
                
                - IMHO Rob -
                

    That Sabastian Bach is in SKIDROW- The opening band for Bon Jovi
    this year. And not too bad.

    
    	No offense but I thought they stunk in concert....I won't
    	mind too much if I get to Great Woods late on June 30.
    

    
    RE: Rob
    
    
     AAAcccckkkk  !!!!
    
    
    
       I can not wait until the Honky Tonk Man gets his A$$ kicked by
       
    
              Super Fly  Jimmy Snucka
    
    
     :')  Sax
    
    

    
.13>    	All the article said was that Kip Winger used to
.13>    	go out with a girl in Denver...


	 FWIW....(I've just read all this note....)  Kip Winger is
	 FROM Denver.  I've heard quite a few radio spots with him
	 around here.

	 /wildkat    

    
    
    	Kip derives from the latin word "Kiabo" which we all know
    	today as "Bozo" so what we have here is a winged Bozo! ;')
    
    	Hollywood.......................the swami!

    
        If it wasn't for James Taylor's cover of "Up on the Roof",
        then Kip's rendition of "Purple Haze" would be the WORST 
        cover I've ever heard.
    
                                                       GTI
    

    I don't know, I kind of liked it.  At least it wasn't you're average
    "same as the original" cover, the arrangement was quite different then
    Hendrix's version.
    
    BTW:  Dweezil Zappa also played on that cut.  If you listen, then go
    listen to "My Guitar Wants To Kill Your Mama" (the song, not
    necessarily the whole album), you'll hear an immediate similarity.  I
    think it's cool.
    
    gh

        
       I usually go in for the harder/heavier type tunage but Winger is
    really good!  "Winger" has turned into one of my most played albums.
    I saw them in concert and thought they kicked.  One thing that is
    interesting about their album is that all the songs on the second 
    side seem to be in sequence.  Next time you listen to side two see
    if it doesn't sound like the story of a relationship gone boom to
    bust.  As far as "Purple Haze" goes well...
    
    Jim who is sticking his neck out on the soft stuff.
    

Does anyone know what kind of guitar Reb is playing in the "Heading for a 
Heartbreak Video"? I think it looks great, and was just wondering if anyone 
knew the make/model. 

BTW - I really like his solo at the end of that tune - real Beck-ish....

cat

    RE: -1
    
    Thats the same guitar he plays in the Madelane video too.  Its a
    Pensa Surr, a custom made LA jobbie that goes for BIG BUCKS (~$2500.)
    He sez it plays like a dream, and when he gets some more $$$, he'll
    get another one.  

> Its a Pensa Surr, a custom made LA jobbie that goes for BIG BUCKS (~$2500.)

No wonder I didn't recognize it! Oh well, it was a nice thought while it 
lasted.....

Hey - at least it shows I have good (or expensive) taste!   8^)

cat

     Reb Beach has become a hit ticket for endorsements for guitar gear.
    I'm sure he's increased the Pensa-Suhr market segment. The last big
    endorser they had is/was Mark Knophler (sic?).
     Reb has also sold quite a few Kitty Hawk amps because of his
    visibility. I've talked to the distributor and they credit him with
    a lot of sales. I bought my first KH amp in Sept '88 and they were
    virtually unknown. It made me feel better when I saw Winger  on
    MTV cranking through Kitty Hawks.

    I may be wrong, but I thought that Pensa-Suhr were made in NYC.

    Well, for only $2300 Joe, you could have one of your very own (at least
    according to an interview I read in some mag with Reb Beach) AND find
    out where they're made!  8^)  
    
    Koa wood sure is pretty...
    
    gh 

    
    	Winger's new album will be called "In the Heart of the Young",
    	and should be out within a couple months.
    
    							GTI
    

Good, I was starting to wonder if these guys were going to just fade off into
oblivion or what (no comments, please).

gh

    Hey, I like (MOST) of Winger's first album. I love the crunching
    guitar/bass riffs in tunes like "Madelaine", great musicians.
    
    /Motorbreath

    It's a shame such talented musicians get taken so lightly because the
    lyrics are so lame.  I liked a lot of the MUSIC on the 1st album too,
    but Kip Winger gets on my nerves !  Guess it's 'cuz I don't shake hands
    sitting down, ya get it ?
    
    Scary ....

    First, I noticed Winger's music.  I heard them on MTV, and I thought it
    was a kickin' tune.
    THEN I noticed Kip,
    And last, I noticed he was wicked stuck up.
    
    In my opinion, the drummer, Rod Morganstein was the coolest
    guy in the band.
     
    

>    In my opinion, the drummer, Rod Morganstein was the coolest
>    guy in the band.

Yeah, Rod is an awesome drummer! He did some great stuff when he was in the 
Dixie Dregs!

And I'm also a big fan of Reb Beach - I can't beleive he plays all that stuff 
with just tapping - it doesn't sound like it at all! (And he also plays a 
beautiful Pensa Sur Koa-wood guitar that I would *kill* to have!)

Yeah, Kippy's a poseur, but at least he had the smarts to get a good band 
behind him....

alan

    Don't discount Kip's ability either.
    I agree some lyrics are lame, but the musicianship is there,
    and as for the poseur stuff...
    hey, if I were in a band and looked like him, I wouldn't go making
    myself look ugly or anything (although I WOULD buy a complete
    t-shirt that covered my hairy nipples.) ;^)
    
    /Motorbreath...lays down a mean bass line

    Hey, I'm not saying Kip's not good-looking, the guy is a most
    luscious babe!  It's just that he gives you that kind of smirk
    like, "I'm too awesome, don't you think?" Although I would
    have to admit he gives the most awesome, sexy-stares you've
    ever seen.
    
    Rod, is a sweetie, and he always smiles.  He's so cool, and has
    no ego trip what-so-ever.
    
    nay
    Hey, Mikey, I like his ripped shirts.  Don't tell me you'd deny
    all the attention you'd get from all those girls, that loved
    your ripped t-shirts!!
    

    
    
    	RE: nay
    
    	Have you ever met the guys from Winger?
    
    	tigga~~~ curious

    Yeah, I met them last year.  Why?
    
    nay
    

    
    	I was just curious to know if you were referring more
    	to their stage presence or if you had actually met them
    	to know what they were like, that's all.
    
    	tigga~~~

    I think they did put on a really good show, besides, the point.  They
    were all good, it's hard to pick out one who is "Better", then the
    other, but if I had to I suppose Kip was the  most entertaining to
    watch, (the way he moves around on that stage, whew!)
    
    nay
    

     I picked up "In the Heart of the Young" and have been giving it
    a few runs through. Not bad - It doesn't have the impact the first
    release had, the guitar doesn't grab you like a lot of cuts on the
    first release. My fave solo from Winger 1 was "Headed for a
    Heartbreak". 
     Check out "Baptised by Fire" on the new release - Winger Raps!
    "Can't Get Enough" - pop-metal radio-bound. I'll be listening to
    it some more and see what grows on me.
    
    						--boom--

I agree BoOmeR.  It doesn't have the punchy Kitty tone.
It's also a little more "poppy" than their first effort.

I picked it up last night.  It's got some scorching guitar
riffs in there, but those laney amps kinda made
Rebs tone less "rad".

IMHO

    
    Hey, Coop! 
    
    Me thinks you guyz are just biased!!!  ;*)
    
    SoHong

    
    	"Can't Get Enough" is a great song!!  The vocals are great ...
    	much better than the high-pitched stuff that became hits from
    	the first album.  That stuff was good, but I think the new one
    	shows a "vocal progression" of sorts for Kip.
    
    	The girls in the video are rather nice too.
    
    							GTI
    

    Really?  I don't like that song much at all.  Too much overall pop, not
    much substance.  Seems like the music is kind of boring...(or maybe it
    was just ME that was bored)
    
    Greg

      Agreed on Can't Get Enough G.H. , it has radio written all over
    it. My favorite cut? "Little Dirty Blonde" for sure, and there's
    something about "Baptised by Fire" that has struck me (even with
    the rap insert) with its transitions. 
      Nothing on this album makes me wanna go out and buy the Laney
    amps listed in the endorsements. Maybe Reb should run a Quattro
    into the effects return of his Lamey ("m" on purpose).
    
    						-BooM-

    re: Lamey
    
    Yer killin' me, Boom!  I'm dying!!!   *^)
    
    I haven't heard the rest of the album yet.  That one track turned me
    off enough to curb my interest, even though I really liked the first
    album.  I'll probably get it sometime, but I won't be exactly busting
    down the door at the record place for this one.
    
    gh

    I just saw (endured) the video for "Silent Night" ... yep, Winger
    butchered the classic Christmas carol.  Reb Beach thinks he's a fat
    black chick, with his vocal additions.  All acoustic (uh-caustic) and
    everyone was wearing little santa caps with their name on 'em ... put
    it this way, UB40 came on next and it was a big step up !   8^)
    
    Scary

    
    
    Reb Beach thinks he's a what?
    
    F.

    Not meant as a racial slam, just that he's real bluesy, and it sounds
    pretty strange in the middle of a Christmas song ...   8^)
    
    Scary

    Winger's Paul Taylor left the band opting to work on his songwriting
    career.
     Kip says....The next album will be heavy and guitar oriented.
    
                     Frizkid
    

    
    
    the Metallica Pre-Concert movie had some home video shots of the band
    members throwin' darts at a kip winger poster.
    
    
    
    Chris

    I liked the first Winger album, good catchy guitar-rock, but the second
    one was WAY lame.  Major synth action with bogus tunes!  What happened
    to the interesting sounds???
    
    Skip/Bob and I saw them on their first tour and they were great!  They
    put on an excellent show!
    
    gh

    I saw Winger on the first tour (Kitty Hawk city!) and it rooled!
    Cool band.
    
    Didn't bother even buying the 2nd lp after hearing those lamo songs
    on the radio!

    
    I'm pretty sure I have the first album (somewhere) but the second one
    was more of a Kip Winger_showing_off_his_looks album. I didn't buy it.
    
    
    
    
    Christ
      !
     -+-
      !
      !

    I really liked their first album.  Greg's right though, the 2nd one is
    Lame-O!

    I saw them about a year ago supporting the Scorpions(Bonzo was there
    too!)they were,well,mmmm...........shite but Kip does have nice teeth.
    
    
                                             Staynz

    Winger is promising a new one by summertime which promises to be
    heavier and more groove-oriented.
    
             Frizkid
    

I just can't wait, said in a voice dripping with sarcasm!



GAZ

    Pffffft!!!

    I wish they would replace the drummer.
    
    I feel like this isn't really Rod's thing (4/4 straight time).  He's
    not a standout in Winger - he's a standout with the Dregs.
    
    	db

    When I saw Winger on their first tour, I thought Rod was definately a
    standout.  An outstanding musician in all respects.
    
    Greg

    What I meant to say was that when I listen to him on a Dregs tune I say
    "Damn, what a good drummer".
    
    When I hear a Winger tune he doesn't sound like he's doing anything
    different than a zillion other pop metal drummers.
    
    Now the guitar player in Winger, Reb Beach,.... that's another story.
    
    	db

They could replace **>> REB BEACH <<** in Winger and no one would 
notice ?!?!?!?!?!

Ack!
Thud!  (jc - hitting the floor)

    
    i thought he meant rod morgenstein, but i reread the note and it's hard
    to tell who he's referring to...

    I re-read it:
    
    The title was: They could replace him and you wouldn't notice.
    
    In the note I said that "Rod sounds like a zillion other pop metal
    drummers" and "Now Reb... that's another story."
    
    It shouldn't be hard to figure out which one I thought could be
    replaced without noticing.
    
    I agree that probably both those guys are probably "talent wasted" in
    something like "Winger".  But I think Reb brings something new to the
    band.
    
    Rod seems happy to just sit back and beat out standard pop metal stuff.
    
    Whereas with the Dregs, he's got a very well-defined unique style.
    
    What I love about Rod's style with the Dregs is the way he can sorta
    "imply" time without actually playing it.  That is, using things like
    ghost hits and such he can give a very solid feel for the time without
    actually giving you it with bass/snare patterns.
    
    He's also just plays more "out" with the Dregs.

    Personally, I don't discount Rod in the WInger medium.  You know,
    I can hear a lot of prowess is a good drummer, even is a 'less is
    more' situation.  Like the drummer for SHOTGUN MESSIAH (Stixx)...
    this guy can PLAY...but often it's not WHAT he's playing technically,
    but how he has set up the groove.

Just checkin', DB.  :)

jc (who thinks Neil Peart would 'pale' in a band with Reb, else it'd be noise)

    re: Buck
    
    I know what you're saying, but I think there's a million guys who can
    set up the groove as well as Rod does.
    
    I'm also not saying that Rod's better than anybody else, but I feel
    the things that he does exceptionally well just don't surface in
    a band like Winger.
    
    By the way, Rod's prowess is not IMHO, massive physical feats of
    drumming ala Peart.  I.E. the way most people would measure chops
    wouldn't have Rod as a standout.
    
    I think his forte is "playing totally out while still sounding 'in'".
    There's not many guys who do THAT well, and thus that's why I sorta
    feel he's wasted in Winger (perhaps "wasted" both literally and
    figuratively ;-)
    
    He's best playing with the progressive guys like Morse, Holdsworth,
    etc..
    
    It's a style thing more than a physical thing.
    
    	db
    
    

    He may be wasted or wasting his talent but he's making a HELL_OF_ALOT_
    MORE_MONEY and probably having ALOT_MORE_FUN.
    
             Frizkid
    

    I seriously doubt he's having more fun.  I really believe his heart is
    in the fusion music, where there's some challenge to the drumming
    involved.  
    
    Probably was making pretty good money...at least until Winger went down
    the tubes.  He's probably eating macraroni and powdered cheese about
    now though.    
    
    gh

    re: .129
    
    Time out ... you think it's OK for him to play for money/fun, but slam
    cover_bands for the same thing.  Which side are ya on anyhow ?   8^)
    
    
    Jerry 

    I also doubt he's having more fun playing with Winger, although the
    quality of his life may be better.
    
    I've seen him with both.  I think that he has more fun playing with
    the Dregs.  With the Dregs he had this permanent smile on that was
    so obvious that the beginnings of interviews usually made some comment
    about it.
    
    I don't see that with Winger.
    
    	db
    

Kips rule though - NOBODY gets to smile in his band 'cept for him.
(and he only does between pouts :).

jc

    Greg: Did you talk to him?  8) I doubt he's eating powdered cheese from
    the success of Winger's First album.
     So is he a sell-out or did he just wanna a change?
    
     Jerry: It's a very simple/confusing mind you're talking to here....
    I'm on every side....8)  If ya ever visit I tell ya over a beer or 
    something.  
    
      A read-only noter told me about a week ago...That I came off real
    bad on the cover band thing.  I went back and read it and:
    
    While I still feel that you should do originals.....It's your life
    and I'm not here to tell ya how to live it. Is that better? 8)
    
    BTW-FWIW-Bruce Springsteen is sueing a bar/cover band and the owner of
    the bar because the band did a song by him. I guess the band and owner
    weren't paying ASCAP and BMI. While Bruce has EVERY right to do this
    I think it was kinda uncalled for.  Wierd, That I take that stand on
    it.  But if a idol/musician of mine was in a bar and I played a song
    of his/hers out of respect and he sued. I'd be a little mad....
    
             Frizkid
    

>    Greg: Did you talk to him?  8) I doubt he's eating powdered cheese from
>    the success of Winger's First album.
    
    No, I haven't talked to him.  Winger's first album was fairly
    successful, but I didn't think it was enough to leave anyone in the
    band set for life.  Their second effort was a major flop.
    
    re: Jerry
    
    It's simple, dude.  Friz likes what you do if you play original music
    in the vein that he likes.  It's ok with him to sell out to do that. 
    But if you play something he doesn't like, or play covers, then you
    suck.  EZ!
    
    gh

RE: Greg

Major flop ??  I still hear a couple tunes from his second album
on KATM and KILO...While I agree it wasn't NEARLY as good as the first 
album, I wouldn't call it a flop - I bet it went platinum, or at least
gold...

jc

    It had like one sorta hit and everyone I know hated it anyway.  I
    seriously doubt it went plat.  Their tours even dogged!
    
    Hear it on KILO or KATM?  My point exactly, it *had* to be lame.
    
    gh

    Greg: Wrong.....Keep trying to firgue me out but that's not it at all.
    
                   Frizkid
    

    
    fwiw, I don't even remember hearing the second Winger stuff..  Was
    there songs that got radio airplay out here?
    
    
    
    Goddess F.

    Yea...I think they had a weak song out called "Easy come, Easy go"
     ACK!
    
            Frizkid....Bring back stuff like "17".
    

    Only song they did that I like was "Madelaine" (spelling?).
    
    That song got me hooked but I was dissapointed with nearly everything
    else they did.
    
    Very cool intro to that song though...
    
    > Bring back stuff like "17"
    
    Yuck - the lyrics in that song make it seem like one of those tunes
    that seem written by record companies based on demographics.
    
    "Dad says she's too young, but she's old enough for me"
    
    That lyric inspires me to propose a new standard abbreviation for HM:
    
    	GMAFB - Give me a ____ing break

    
    According to Alice Cooper, Kip is fluent in martial arts.

Kip is from Colorado Springs... FWIW.

jc

    I thought he was from Denver?
    
          Frizkid
    

    "17"=Yuck?  I thought it was a cool song...
    The lyrics weren't that great but still decent.
       There is not one band out there that doesn't have GMAFB lyrics...
    (Unless they're instrumental) 8P
    
    I'm not a true fan of Winger but I think some of their stuff is kinda
    cool.  I'll have to keep an ear out for their third album since Kip
    boy promises it to be different.
    
                Frizkid
    

    re: .145 (Frizkid)
    
    > There is not one band out there that doesn't have GMAFB lyrics...
    
    Oh yeah?
    
    How about Rod's OLD band: The Dixie Dregs.
    
    You find me one Dixie Dregs (as opposed "The Dregs") album with a GMAFB
    lyric!
    
    Actually find me a Dixie Dregs album with ANY lyrics.
    
    ;-)

    Yeah,  I'd agree that Winger's lyrics are pure pulp.  I liked them for
    the music and I gloss over most of the lyrics of bands these days
    anyway...
    
    I really liked the guitar hook in "17".  
    
    As I recall there were two songs from the second album that got some
    minor airplay and video showing on MTV, "Can't Get Enough" and "EZ
    Come, EZ go" (Cheezy Come, Cheezy...)  I didn't care for either, they
    both reminded me of really long chorus's with no verses.  Booooring.
    
    gh

    
    	Which album was "Miles Away" from?  the second one
    	wasn't it?
    

    JJ: Yea....Miles Away is from the second one.  How could I forget when
    they played it into the ground. 8)
    
            frizkid
    

    
    
        Spoke with a friend of Reb Beach's this weekend.  She said while
    he is not set for life, Winger's success has allowed him to buy a
    house.  I imagine Kip's financial situation is similar.
    
    	Also, the band is looking for a new producer and the rhythm guitarist 
    is no more.
     
    
    Paul

    I hope that their new producer gives 'em a little rougher edge then
    whoever did the last album.  It was so glossy, sickening sweet, that is
    was real close to unlistenable for me.
    
    They have a lot of talant, wish they could package it in a way I'd
    enjoy more.
    
    gh

    
      Re: .141
    
        The intro to "Madelaine" was done wiht the guitar in Nashville
      tuning, hnce the unique sound thats hard to try to duplicate with
      a guitar in standard tuning. Nashville tuning require changing 
      strings to different gauges. I've got the Reb Beach "Cutting Loose"
      video as well.
    
        Agreed - lyrics are bopperish and the axe work and musical content
      of the second release didn't mesure up to W1. (It was the Kitty's!)
    
    							-B()()M-

    
    Any new offerings from Kip and Co. ?
    
    They're one of these bands that have some exellent tunes ('Seventeen',
    'Can't get enough' etc..) and some *really* bad ones. Still, it might
    be worth stealing the new album when they release it.
    
    -Tony

    I kinda liked their first album at the time, but I don't really listen
    to it any more.  I never got the second album because nothing I heard
    off it appealed to me.  It was like they took the commercial aspects of
    their sound from the first album to a new and disgusting extreme and I
    couldn't deal with it.
    
    They're clearly talented musician's, but they need to get back to
    making music rather then that pablum they did the last time.
    
    In any case, I don't remember if I mentioned it before, but I saw the
    Steve Morse Band a few months ago, and he mentioned that he would be
    doing a Dregs reunion tour in a few months, "...when Rod [Morgenstein,
    the drummer for Winger and the Dregs] get's done recording in the
    studio with Winger".  The Dregs reunion tour's already happened(ing),
    so I can only presume that at least the basics are done on the new
    Winger album.
    
    gh

    
    Heard the new Winger single on 1FM earlier titled 'Blind Revolution'. 
    Typical stuff for them, if only their writing was more consistant they
    might be a good band. 
    
    -Tony

    I heard it too, but thought the name was something a *little*
    different (but don't remember it).  IT sounded typically Winger
    to me...
    
    jc (WHo sez the guitar tone changed *again* :-)

    Did it start off 'mellow' with acoustic guitars, Kip droning on, and
    then proceed to the ejeculation part ?
    
    -Tony

    I think these guys should dump their drummer.
    
    	db - with alterior motives

>    	db - with alterior motives

    "ulterior"...    

	I caught Winger last night at Saratoga Winners here in N.Y.

	Here is a quick review..
	
	Opening Band #1:  Bluehouse a band from N.Y.C. nothing really
			  iimpressive about them at all.
	Opening Band #2:  Sweetwater, just signed to a record deal I guess
			  they sucked!!!!  They are from Seattle (ANY BAND
			  from there will get signed!  I am convinced of
			  that!)  They are 60's leftovers, that play 
			  60s music crossed with grudge, terible!
			  (terible = GLH would love them!) heheheheheh
	Winger : They put on a fantastic show!!!! Reb was great, 
		  they did a good mix of their three albums everyone
		  was really into it, and the place was pretty packed.
		 

    They must have a new album out 'cause I heard a Winger song that I'd
    never heard on the radio this morning.  Heavier then anything else I've
    heard from them.  Marginally listenable, but they still sound vaguely
    like Warrant.  Reb's solo didn't fit the song at all, and I started
    feeling nauseous thinking of Kip's perfect teeth smiling at me and I
    had to change the station.
    
    Greg

    
    	Sounds like Warrant?
    
    	Great!!
    
    							GTI

    
    
    	Ugh.  I'd rather have 'em sound like themselves.  I
    	like their other stuff.
    

    Hmmm... Winger is still together???
    
    I was under the belief that Rod Morgenstein (the drummer) had gone back
    to the Dregs and was recording an album with them and doing gigs as
    well.
    
    I like some of the stuff Winger has done ("Madelaine" or whatever it's
    called was pretty cool - almost like "Pop rock meets Dream Theater")
    but frankly, IMHO that's just not Rod's style of drumming.   In that band
    he sounds like every other "pop metal" (or whatever you call it) 
    band on the radio.
    
    The area where he really shines is doing his own style with the Dregs.
    
    	db

>    	Ugh.  I'd rather have 'em sound like themselves.  I
>    	like their other stuff.
    
    Don't worry, it's not *that* different...