Conference napalm::guitar

	Playing outside is nice in an aesthetic sense, but typically 
	the sound quality is the pits !  You either need to be playing 
	in a place where there's buildings or hills immediately nearby
	to reflect the sound back, or you need some serious wattage to
	get a decent sound.   Tone suffers big time when there's no
	reflections coming back.

	At least that's been my experience.

	Lv

    What you noticed is typical of working outdoors.  
    
    First of all, there are no walls or ceiling so all the reinforcement of
    low end you get from them is absent.  Not to mention that there is no
    reflected sound so it seems that your amp is more directional when
    outdoors.  Finally, the lack of reflective surfaces means the apparent
    volume of the amp is lower and the tendency is to compensate by turning
    up. This probably accounts for the brittleness and buzziness you
    noticed.
    
    A big help is to just use more speakers.  Remember that not only
    doubling cone area give you 3db more signal, but it also improves low
    end response.  if you locate the speakers around the stage, you also
    improve the directionality problem.   
    
    I normally use only one bass cabinet when indoors, but for outdoor gigs
    I *always* add a second cabinet.  The improvement in sound is *very*
    noticeable.  Since you may not play outdoors too often, this is a good
    case for borrowing or renting a cab for the gig.
    
    Some other things to watch out for outdoors is drifting tuning and the
    inability to see LED indicators in the sunlight.
    
    						Buster Bloodvessel

    weather permitting, playing outside is fun, but the tone usually sux. 
    My last few sit in gigs were outside, but we were at the bottom of a
    hill on a cul de sac in a suburban neighborhood.  Our sound was
    bouncing back off of houses and the hillside in front of us.  It was
    possibly my first outside gig where I didn't feel like I was trying to
    fill up a 50' helium balloon with a bicycle pump.....
    
    Get more speakers........
    
    steev

    
    
    Another thing to look out for is ear fatigue when you're dialing in
    your sounds the night before.  An ear's high-end response rolls off
    first, which might tend to make one dial in sounds with a bit too much
    of the high frequency components.  The symptoms include: super-crispy
    sounds the next day, and ringing ears.
    
    So, given the data from the previous replies, along with my BS, sounds
    like there's not much point in trying to get the perfect tone(s) the
    night before.  Save it for the sound check?
    

    Gee, I must be wierd or something, I always preferred playing outside.
    I always seem to get a great tone when outside.  Probably because I get
    to crank it up a lot louder because the vocal P.A. can go twice as loud
    with no walls to feedback on.   This usually results in those party
    poopers dressed in blue showing up a lot sooner too, so it does have
    its drawbacks.

    The previous replies sum up the basic fact that to get good sound
    outdoors depends on how well you can control the movement of vibrating
    air and how well you contain as much harmonic content as possible prior
    to its getting lost.  This is what makes some acoustic architects rich.
    Plain and simple though, if you're playing in a wide open environment
    with no kind of surrounding structure to contain the immediate sound,
    it's just going to disperse in all directions as soon as it's generated
    and disappear rapidly.
    
    One thing I've found that makes a big difference in helping the sound
    is to play on a raised wooden platform.  The wood helps to resonate and
    amplify things even in the absence of any surrounding structures.
    
    While we're on the subject, one of the best outdoor places I've played
    (for acoustics) is the Ruth Gordon Amphitheatre, located in Quincy, MA.
    Anyone else played there?  It's a recessed cement stage that's surrounded 
    by cement seats/steps and has a backdrop constructed of fieldstone in
    the rear of the stage.  What's surprising is how well cement and stone
    act as acoustic barriers.
    
    Now if I can only solve my next problem: how to keep the charts from 
    blowing all over the place when the wind blows!
    
    -Ralph  
     

re -1 Ralph, simple, clothes pins.  :-)

Works for me.

GONZO

    Surprising ????
    
    Cement & stone have been known as excellent acoustic barriers for over
    70 years.
    
    More speakers (for reasons already mentioned) is one of the top
    priorities. More "wood" may help too (I'd use a "big" Bandmaster bottom 
    outdoors & a "small" Bandmaster bottom indoors. Luckily, I have one of
    each.) because of the larger surface area of the speaker baffle & the
    improved low end response possible with a big cabinet. 
    
    Forget about trying to get the perfect sound the night before.
    Outdoors, the sound is not even close to the same as a 10x12 room. 
    The good news is that you probably don't have to kill anyone with
    volume outdoors any more than you have to indoors if you've got your
    stuff balanced & EQ'd well (It helps to mike everything through
    something HUGE.).
    
    The other perennial outdoor "gothca" is of course your friendly (?)
    neighborhood AC power feed. You really should use serious AC power line
    conditioning for *everything* (yes, all of the 1000 watt PA power amps 
    too !). That goes double (unless all your electrical equipment is
    disposable) when you're running from a generator as opposed to the
    plain AC mains. Run several extension cords (so you can get zapped real
    good if the ground polarity is wrong) of the largest gauge wire you can
    find, & then condition the beatlejuice out of everything. The lead
    guitar amps may actually be a lower priority, because with enough line
    voltage drop, you can get that "tweed" sound for free. (So you don't
    even have to buy that black faced Deluxe you've had your eye on !)
    
    BTW, have the road crew (for the other band) check your GND polarity.
    
    Paul 

    RE .7
    
    
    
    			CHARTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    
    p.k.

    If I may be allowed a word as an acoustic player (bluegrass guitar), I
    would far rather play outside than in.
    
    Jamming in a group inside makes the sound bounce around all over the
    place. Outside, the sound can dissapate nicely.
    
    
    andy

    re: 2804.10 by CHEFS::IMMSA
     Amen! Especially if its outside, in a campground at night around a
    fire at a bluegrass festival. Amazing how many GOOD musicians show up
    for campground pickin' at decent sized bluegrass festivals...
    
    chuck

    
>    Jamming in a group inside makes the sound bounce around all over the
>    place. Outside, the sound can dissapate nicely.
    
	especially the banjo???
    
    

>	especially the banjo???
 
    ...and if it doesn't, you can always toss it into the campfire.   

     along with the person playing that hideous instrument :^)
    
    chuck

    
       While I was "playing outdoors" in the garage,  (Okay, okay,
    I was cleaning the garage.)  Anyway, last night at 11:30 or so, 
    there was some question on the radio.  Answer and win.  
    
       Of course the person who had the answer was ALAN STARR.
                                                  ------------
    
       How much you wanna bet it was the "REAL" Alan Starr?
    
       I wonder if he'll show up and claim his prize.  Naaaa, He'll
    probably give someone Power Of Attorney.   Alan NEVER shows up.
    Or he could send one his many decoys.  Clones maybe? 
     
       Maybe if McGiever and Lovejoy team up, they'll be able to find him.
     

    What was the question?
    
    						Art Fleming

    It was really Dave Hickernell.............I told you guys Alan Starr
    doesn't exist.  I mean, think about it.  What are the chances that
    someone would have the last name Starr and be a
    singer/guitarist.....c'mon guys, wake up and smell the petunias.....
    
    Steve

    Actually, Steve, you may be right... Alan and I have been seen together
    a few times recently.  And my wife will vouch for the fact that I'm
    often not really there.
    
    Dave

    RE: "Smell *this*, Steevo!"
    
    
    phewwww....no thanks!
    
    8*}