Conference hydra::amiga_v1

    Four weeks ago I was told "two weeks, for sure".
    Two weeks ago I was told, "one more week, but call to be sure".
    
    I expect the 2000 to be available by Christmas.  If it isn't
    somebody at Commodore's head will roll, I betcha.
        John Sauter

    General Computer in Framingham MA said they'd have a demo next week.
    Production quantities are about a month away.
    
    

    
    	I was in the Software Shop this Saturday, and in speaking with
    Moe learned that Commodore had shipped the A2000 sometime that week.
    Moe expects them sometime this week or next I guess.  He said he
    was getting 4 or 5 units...My memory is getting kinda fuzzy (school
    ya know)...Anyways, being that 2.5 weeks ago I had decided not to
    wait for the 2000 and buy a refurbed 1000 I think that I am going
    to stick by my decision unless I come by a 1000 dollars or something..
    
    brad

    should be interesting times ahead - i heard Atari will be shipping
    Mega-STs to dealers in the next couple weeks.  Maybe, if we're
    really lucky, that will start a price war.
    
    $2000 is just too much for an empty slot box with the same capabilities
    as the A1000/A500.  CBM needs some competion to make them realize
    that the competition for the A2000 is Atari and PC clones, not the MAC II.
    Apple has enough industry clout to convince card manufactures that
    there is potential profit to be made in the MAC II market, even
    though the installed base is small.  CBM does not have that clout.
    They will need to have a large enough customer base of slot boxes
    to justify the risk.
    
     - Dave

    I think the Mega STs are now available in Europe.  I've heard some
    accounts that it has arrived without the blitter and new ROMS, but
    I've heard one account that it in fact had a blitter.  The blitter
    certainly exists (at least one does) since reliable sources have
    seen it and touched it.
    
    Popular opinion is that they wouldn't dare ship it in the States
    without a blitter and ROM upgrades.  After promising one 'any day
    now' since January '86, they'd better deliver or lose all credibility.
    
    I read a thread on Plink that the prices were higher than expected.
    I think it was $1699 for a 1 meg color system (might have been 2
    megs), and the price seemed to go up around $400/Meg.  Could reflect
    the unsteady prices in 1 MBit DRAMS.  If these prices are even close,
    I think the A500 has it clobbered in every respect except aesthetics.
    
    I still don't think that I really understand the A2000 very well.
    I would much rather have seen a 68020/68881 machine with all Zorro
    ][ slots, and a non-interlaced 640 x 400  color or mono display
    mode.  If they could deliver a machine like that (A 3000 ?) for
    around $2500, they'd have absolutely no competition.  Maybe the
    default A2000 setup will migrate to the 68020 after prices start
    to drop.  Thats an advantage that it should have over the Megas.
    
    Is a Mac ][ worth twice the price of the current A2000?  Probably.
    
    

    It is here!  The amiga 2000 is available at the Software Shop in
    Worcester.  Commodore sent him two.  One Moe, is keeping and using
    as a sort of Demo machine, it had a 2 meg card, the Janus Card (ibm
    pc card), and a 20 meg 3 1/2 hard disk with the commodore hard disk
    controller.  I was told this is the West Chester Design machine
    with the top 512k on the motherboard, not on a card plugged into
    the cpu slot of the motherboard.
    
    List price = 1995.00
    
    I think his price was 1600.00-1700.00 dollars or somesuch.
    (closer to 1700 I do believe)
    
    Plus the Amiga 1000 plus 1000.00 = Amiga 2000 deal.  Moe mentioned
    that the upgrade offer is currently only going to be around for
    45 days.
    
    For those interested in used amiga 1000's, Moe mentioned that
    he probably would be selling them between 400 and 500 dollars 
    since that is how he makes his profit on the upgrade.
    
    brad
    
    ps. Should we start a "Who should upgrade and who shouldn't"
        note?? 
    

    I got to play with the A2000 for a few minutes on Saturday.  It's
    actually a pretty beautiful machine.  The hard drive is extremely
    fast and quiet.  The actual footprint is about the same as the A1000.
    
    I'm very impressed with the Janus software.  Never having really
    tried a Sidecar, I didn't know how well they had integrated the MS-DOS
    environment into Intuition.
    
    With 3 megs, the Bridge Card, 20 Meg HD, and 5 1/4" floppy, this
    demo unit stickered out near $4000!  
    

Re .6:

can anyone confirm the 45 day restriction on upgrades?

	Paul

    
    Re. .8
    
    	I was at the software shop this weekend and moe showed me
    a official letter about the upgrade.
    
    
    Yes, the offer is good for 45 days only.
    
    
    You give
    
    	$1000.00
    	A1000 system unit 256K ( working, no modifications )
    	      keyboard
    	      mouse
    	      documentation
    
    recieve
    
    	A2000 system unit 512K	( NEW )
    	      keyboard
    	      mouse
    	      documentation
    
    NOTHING else, this is it.
    
    
    	The dealer must then send serial numbers and paper work in.
    The returned equipment will be sold "as is".
    
    
    		Steve Peters
    

when does/did the clonk start running on the 45 days?  must be intended to them
with an immediate high volume when demand might otherwise be slow to build.
But I would have thought that this would be accompanied by an official
notification of the offer to all A1000 owners of record.

	Paul

Re: .10

I was talking to the folks at the Memory Location.  They said they expect
twenty to thirty Amiga 2000s to be shipped to them next week.  They expect
to eliminate their backlog in another two or three weeks.

It looks like the Amiga 2000 is going to ship in volume.

I just talked to the Memory Location.  They have not heard of any 45 day limit
on upgrades.  Maybe that is just wishful thinking (or a private policy) by Moe
at the Software Shop.

Now I have to decide!  There do not seem to be a lot of rational reasons to
upgrade, but for some reason I still want to.

Has anyone investigated the availability of add-ons for the 2000, and discount
pricing for them?  Does Abel have memory, hard disk controller, etc.?  If no one
knows, I will make an effort to get thru to Abel on the phone and find out.

	Paul

    There was some mumbling on Plink of a scan-doubler card due out
    RSN (I dunno if it's a CBM or 3 rd party design).  This board would
    allegedly eliminate 640 x 400 flicker by storing the odd scan lines
    for 1/30 second and then sending a true 60 hz refresh to the screen.
    
    Lots of people have discussed the difficulties of such a device,
    and I'm not intelligent enough to make a judgement, so I'm just
    reporting the rumor.
    

    
    I believe the scan-doubler was mentioned in Computer Currents which I
    just received in the mail a few nights ago.  I'll check it out tonight.

    The article was primarily about Desktop Video on the Amiga and was
    quite positive.
        
    - steve mcafee 

    re .13 and .14
    
    Nifty idea. But it won't work on NTSC video, will it? I mean, the whole
    point is to be able to refresh the entire screen in 1/60 sec. This
    would achieve that but a normal screen IS interlaced and would still
    display it interlaced.
    
    Of course, this is a wonderful way to eliminate bandwidth blocking
    problems....
    
    dov
    

    
    I have heard that CSA (Computer Systems Associates, San Diego, CA)
    is shipping a box for $1095.00 called the Turbo Amiga Tower.  While
    everyone is familiar with their 68020 and 32-bit memory stuff, it
    should be noted that their empty chasis (for $1k) would effectively
    upgrade an Amiga 1000 to Amiga2000 status (with respect to slots/
    Bridge-card compatibility: PC, PC/AT hardware slots, coprocessor
    board slot, and Amiga 2000 Enhanced Zoro slots.)
    
    If you don't have an Amiga yet, get yourself one of these $400
    refurbished Amiga 1000's (fully cleaned, drive aligned, and tested
    by an electrical engineer), slap on a Turbo Amiga Tower (for $1k)
    = $1400!!!
    
    Note: (ENABLE RUMOR MODE)
      There are rumors flying around here (in Southern California) that
      CSA may start producing AMIGA clones!  Yes, that's right... and
      you thought the custom-chips would stop that from happening!!..
    
      It seems that they have the intention of buying mass-quantities
      of Amiga 500's and repackaging them in their cases with their
      68000 <-> 68020/68881 adapter card (not the Turbo Tower, just
      the CPU replacement deelee.)  Target price is to be the same or
      less as the A2k from Commodore!
    
      (DISABLE RUMOR MODE)
    
     ..Anyway, one must consider the reliability of CSA vs. CBM when
     looking at either of these two options.  The only knowledge I have
     of CSA other than they make Amiga stuff is that they are also
     involved with major Aerospace projects for Ford and Hughes.
    
    -Tom

    The Turbo Amiga Tower, like the ASDG and PAL boxes, is the OLD Zorro
    standard. The new standard is electrically similar, but physically
    won't fit into the same box. Also, be aware that the new Agnes chips
    (blitter/copper?) are in sockets designed to accomodate replacement
    Agnesi that will address 2M (ie, 2M of chip RAM eventually). This
    is one advantage you will not have with the A1000. ASDG keeps saying
    they are coming out with a 2000-compatible box, but it's vaporware
    at present.

    
    
    	re. 690.17
    
    NO... The turbo Tower was redesigned. It now uses Zorro II slots
    and includes the PC slots. They have been shipping it.
    
    		Steve Peters
    

    
    
    re: .17,.16
    
    ECHO!  The new CSA expansion is definitely 2000 board compatible (it will
    even handle PC XT and PC AT boards if you buy the 2088 board from
    CBM.)                                                 

    
    re: .14
    
    Here's the blurb from Computer Currents:
    
    ' Mimetics Corp., a third-party Amiga developer, announced several
      new Amiga video products at Spring COMDEX.  According to Bob Hoover,
      Director of Product Development, "We are providing all the tools
      that a person needs to do complete audio/video post-production at
      home."  How?  With the "Imagen" genlock for the Amiga 500, which
      lists for $179; with a frame buffer that boosts the display capability
      of the Amiga to two million colors with a resolution of 640x480
      and lists for $699; and with a SMPTE time code generator that lists
      for $199.  '

    - steve mcafee