Conference 7.286::digital

    what does "will work" mean?  Do you expect graphics, or what?  What
    model of Alpha are you dealing with and what operating system?
    
    Mark

    I recently did a similar "substitution" (sent them to CompUSA) on an
    Alpha 2100. Contact the Product Manager for the specific system that
    you have in mind. Assuming that it's one of the newer, PCI-based
    machines, you can generally get away with any good VGA Monitor (not
    terminal) and save them some money to boot. I got the monitor specs for
    the 17" monitor that we could not deliver and it turned out to be
    nothing more than a VGA spec. You should be able to get that from the
    Product Manager.
    
    The terminal route is only really good for VMS (IMHO) server installations.
    The other two Op Sys need/require good graphics capability to be properly 
    run/managed.
    
    -OFWAMI- 

    The system is an AlphaServer 2000 4/200 with VMS operating system.  The
    monitor that has been ordered is a FR-PCXBV-PF which is currently
    scheduled for 6-28 and they are not really sure if it will ship then.
      I have been checking on other monitors trying to
    resolve this issue and all of the monitors have long leads.  As far as
    graphics I have placed a call with my customer to see if he will need
    that capability.
    
    Melody

    What's the problem with monitor availability, given that apparently
    suitable monitors can be bought externally?  Our group is
    also having a significant problem getting workstations
    delivered because of a "monitor shortage".  Does anyone know
    what's going on and if anything is being done to fix this?
    

    Melody
    
    Digital has a Terminals and Printer HOTLINE you can call.  They are
    experts in this field.
    
    The number is 800-777-4343.
    
    Good Luck.
    
    Connie

    >Melody
    >
    >Digital has a Terminals and Printer HOTLINE you can call.  They are
    >experts in this field.
    >
    >The number is 800-777-4343.
    
    The Terminals and Printers Hotline (part of the Components and
    Peripherals Group) can handle technical calls regarding terminals
    and printers.  It is not in our charter to know whether of not
    a terminal can substitute for a monitor on an Alpha system; that's
    a systems question, not a terminal and printers question.
    
    One of the great frustrations I've encountered ever since I joined this
    hotline group is the constant confusion between terminals and monitors;
    granted, it's a grey area, since in a few instances, we DO sell
    monitors (specifically, those connected to our VTlan40s, Multias, VXT
    2000+, and so on) -- however, for the most part we don't provide
    support for monitor questions, especially monitors connected to our PCs
    and workstations.
    
    Your question can best be answered by the appropriate Alpha product
    manager or engineering manager.
    
    					andrew

    
    
    Monitor shortage is worldwide.... glass for CRT is in low supply.
    Everybody int he business is effected. Cost is rising too.
    
    gb

It's probably the VRT17 (PCXAV-EV, Sony Multiscan 17se) which is on allocation
from Sony everywhere.  We have other 17" monitors which can be substituted.
Yes, a VT terminal can be used - probably best to take the question to
VAXAXP::ALPHANOTES for details.

						Steve

    Thanks to the responses in notes and those of you who responded via
    A-1.  I think I have enough avenues to solve the problem one way or
    another.
    
    Thanks,
    
    Melody

  I too got confused about the difference between a terminal and a monitor for
a while. The rule of thumb is that a monitor usually has a direct wired con-
nection to a single, nearby computer and a terminal usually acccesses a com-
puter in another part of the building, to which it is not directly cabled.

>The rule of thumb is that a monitor usually has a direct wired connection
>to a single, nearby computer and a terminal usually acccesses a computer in
>another part of the building, to which it is not directly cabled.
   
   Unfortunately, the newest family of terminals further blurs the
   boundary. The VT525, TVlan40 and Multia all use use monitors as their
   CRT device; the first two are nothing more complicated that multi-
   session text or text/graphics terminals.  The distinction (and the
   problem) has less to do with the technology than with "who gets the
   credit for the sale."
   
   					andrew

    What makes life even more fun is that in the wonderful new Digital the
    same monitor can have many different part numbers depending as to
    whether it's from VIPS, the SBU or PCBU ... and of course they also
    have different pricing.

    The point of my earlier reply is somehow getting lost. Don't hold up
    the bulk of the system revenues waiting for a piece that you can buy
    cheaper at any local computer store. The customer has probably already
    paid for a PCI-based PC graphics board. All he/she needs is a $300-400
    monitor to get up and running (more if they are really using it for
    graphics). Get out last Sundays's computer store ads and cancel the
    monitor off the Digital order. If the customer doesn't need the monitor
    for any other use than just managing the sytem as a server, any old VT
    that he has laying around will probably do, assuming that you have a
    way to hook it up.
    
    -OFWAMI- 
    
    

    andrew,
    
    At least one older terminal also used a monitor (GIGI) and several had
    RGB outputs.
    
    Mark

Just FYI:

  A "Monitor" accepts one or more video input signal(s). Conceptually,
  there's no logic or intelligence inside a monitor and the monitor
  doesn't modify the video signal(s) in any way, it just paints them
  over and over again onto the display screen.  (This lack of intel-
  ligence isn't strictly true any more with the latest, computerized
  multi-scan monitors, but the concept is still true. The computer
  is just aiding in obtaining an accurate representation of the
  video input signal(s).)


  A "Terminal" accepts digital data using some sort of protocol
  and contains at least some minimal intelligence (even if it's
  only the mechanical intelligence of a TTY's "stunt box").  A
  few popular terminal protocols (not mutually exclusive, BTW):

    o RS-232/423/422 serial data
    o IBM Coax or Twinax cables
    o Ethernet
    o ASCII
    o ANSI
    o SNA ("3270")
    o X
    o Telnet

  A terminal may require that a monitor be attached to it.

                                   Atlant

>  A terminal may require that a monitor be attached to it.

Before I read Atlant's reply, I was ready to make the 
assertion that "all terminals have monitors".

Oh, how quickly we forget!

    This isn't just a problem for the 17 inch sizes. I've been working on a
    project for a customer that represents a revenue potential of 4-5
    billion (with a "B") dollars over the next 3 years. We'll be replacing
    or upgrading some 55,000 PC's at 3500 sites worldwide, plus providing
    hardware and software support to the desktop.
    
    Last month we were installing new systems for their software
    development group. We're talking 100 or so Celebris 590's with 40 meg
    of ram and 540 meg hard drives (minimum). Very nice stuff. Problem is,
    the customer ordered them with our 21 inch monitors. We got the CPU
    boxes and installed them, but had to leave their "old" 14 inch monitors
    on their desks until the 21 inchers came in. 5 weeks later, we're still
    waiting (and the customer is NOT happy, to say the least).
    
    The good news is, the customer gave HP first crack at this project.
    They got kicked out after their first pilot site. We successfully
    completed 4 pilot sites and have started rolling out across the US
    (with the remainder of the planet to soon follow). They'd be much
    happier if we could deliver the parts they order, when we say we will!
    
    Harry