Conference 7.286::digital

    yeah, it's pretty sickening isn't it?   I work in HLO and it happens
    here every once in awhile.. (it's not just limited to equipment stuffs
    either..  We had a rash of money being taken out of pocket books..
    one guy I know had his wifes picture taken off his desk!!)
    
    As for security, I fully support them needing to search these huge
    bags, boxes and similar containers people bring in and out of buildings..
    People shouldn't complain if they have nothing to hide.. 
    They should also consider regulating the NCS (keycard) access ways
    offhours and weekends..
    

 I just heard that somebody, presumably an employe, stole a CD from the
 LJO2 Library.  This was about a $100 piece of software.  Peanuts compared
 to what was taken from the author of -.1, but still.....

 I don't care how bad things are in the company or how bad they get, there
 is no excuse for this type of criminal behavior.  I hope that if these
 folks get caught, they are prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law and 
 not just fired.

 Disgustedly,

 Stu .....  >:^(

    Damn. I'm about to move from MLO to MRO2. I'll be the first from my
    group to arrive. 
    
    I think I'll lock everything in the lab until the population
    increases..
    
    ...tom

    Karen,
    
    We have had a thefts in our area.  When we first moved to MRO3
    from UPO (2 years ago), almost all (approx. 6 people) of our PC
    software was stolen.  Some of the SW boxes were out in the open but
    mine was stolen out of my file cabinet.  This means someone was
    intentionally looking through drawers.  Since that time the only real
    thefts have been food out of refrigerators/offices.   It's sad to think
    that there are people who we work with that will steal like that but
    that's reality.
    
    I now lock up any valuables that I don't want taken.  One thing that
    the women in Digital should become more aware of is not leaving their
    purses/handbags out in the open in their offices.  My mother learned
    that lesson the hard way - someone "lifted" her wallet, took all the
    money and put the wallet back.  It wasn't until that evening that she
    realized the money was gone.  She had tucked away 2-$20 bills in a side
    pocket of that wallet and that was gone as well.  So you never know.  I
    frequently will come back to my desk to find a total stranger using my
    phone so the thieves may not be someone you even know.
    
    

    
    	A worthwhile topic.
    
    	Same thing happened to me when we moved from DSG
    	to MRO1. Someone stole an expansion box for my 3100
    	that contained about 600 Meg of very very important data.
    	The impact was quite high.
    	Never did recover it and I must admit that I was and am
    	less than impressed with security.
    	Filled out the papers as soon as the theft was discovered
    	and that seems to have been the [sad] end to the story.
    	Still, can't complain too much about security as they were
    	quite busy ticketing illegally parked cars.
    	Obviously  theft is a low priority for them.
    
    	Bottom line, I am sorely disappointed in those fellow 
    	employees that would do such a thing and even more
    	disappointed with so-called security.
    
    							Hank

    It's only going to get worse.  A 2Gb RZ28 disk measures 2x4x6 and can be
    used on most any computer around, including home PC's.  That's small
    enough to fit into my winter coat pocket, let alone a purse or
    briefcase.  With storage works boxes, removing a disk from a machine is
    trivial.
    
    We came to work one day to find an adjacent group had a machine that
    wouldn't work.  Someone had opened it up and stole 6 of the 8 memory
    cards.  (Of course all 8 are needed for any of it to work so one
    wonders about the effectiveness of this theft.)
    
    In California, criminals are robbing chip warehouses.  Microchips,
    486s, Pentiums, etc, are worth more than their weight in gold and are
    quite easy to resell.
    
    I'm not sure what security can do about it though.  Of course, if we
    had walls and doors and locks, we could lock up our offices, but that's
    not the way things are done in our industry.
    
                                    August

We've had memory boards taken out of systems in the lab.  I remember a dozen
years ago hearing of people finding their VT125s "gutted".  Portable CD
players often disappear.  It's scary.

				Steve

    Commenting on the increase in the rate of theft in this note has two
    benefits:
    
    1  It alerts others to the risks that exist
    
    2  WRT disks being taken we will start/resume thinking about having the
       data backed up into a more secure computing environment.
    
       With the technology, kit and skills we have at our disposal there's
       no real need to lose 600 meg of data.  Is there?

    I'm surprised nobody has mentioned coffee money being stolen.
    It happened to us in LTN1.  The real concern: the area was 
    so small, there weren't any strangers in the area during the
    morning, therefore, the thief was one of *US*.
    
    I heard of a secretary in TWO, who cashed her check at lunchtime,
    left it in her pocketbook and it was stolen before the day was out.
    She worked in a corner (backend of the building) office, so she
    figured it was someone from the group she was supporting.
    
    My father-in-law worked at a chemical company.  Money was dis-
    appearing from desks.  They "sprinkled" a fluorescence powder
    over some $1 bills and left them in a desk drawer.  That night
    everyone leaving the facility had to put their hands under a
    special light.  The thief was a security guard.

    
    Re: .8
    
    Most data was backed up. Still, the recovery time could have been
    better spent working on customer issues, which I'd best get back to.
    

    You can't blame security for everything that goes wrong in this
    company.  Look at how many people abuse the rules at Digital.  We are
    supposed to wear our badges but do we?  No.  We are supposed to sign
    in/out of buildings after hours but do we?  The few times that I've
    seen security initiate a "spot" inspection you would have thought that
    they were asking you to take all your clothes off in the lobby from the
    moans and groans.  So we are partly to blame.  I worked at Millipore
    years ago and "everyone" had to wear their badges.  If you were caught
    even walking in the halls with it on you were taken back to your desk
    to retrieve it.  Plus EVERY box, large briefcase, etc. was opened in
    front of security prior to leaving the building.  
    
    In the Franklin facility when I worked there, someone was stealing money 
    from people and security did mount some 'hidden' cameras and did 
    catch the guy.  Needless to say he no longer works for Digital.
    
    We have to accept part of the blame.  Yes, it's a pain to lock up
    things and I hate to think that we can't trust our co-workers but look
    at society today.  When was the last time you parked your car on the
    street or in a parking garage and didn't lock it up?  Why should our
    workplace be any different.

    The following reply has been contributed by a member of our community
    who wishes to remain anonymous.  If you wish to contact the author by
    mail, please send your message to ROWLET::AINSLEY, specifying the
    conference name and note number. Your message will be forwarded with
    your name attached  unless you request otherwise.

    Bob - Co-moderator DIGITAL

===============================================================================
    
    Well when I arrived in MRO1 I was surprise to find that someone swiped
    my leather Digital logo'd notebook, and my leather Laptop bag/case.
    They also stole our little cannon electronic typewriter our group had
    for typing forms? Submit the corect paper work with security and 
    nothing ever came of it?
    	
    	I'm not sure if its common knowledge but in MRO1 they had a very
    large theft in the SBO group of upto $600,000 in 486 chips. I've also heard
    the FBI got involved initially but nothing has come of the investigation? 
    They then put these under lock and key and the next week they stole a 
    bunch of 386 chips? The area was never under lock or camera site? And 
    basically anyone could wander in that area.
    
    
    

	Well, being in Security for the MRO area I do have some concerns
	with the information that has been posted so far within this note.  
	I am not here to debate people's personal opinions and perceptions, 
	but I would like to list some facts:

	1) Security has taken a pro-active approach in the MRO area trying
	   to deter thefts such as the ones posted previously.  We have
	   restricted after hour access to all of the our MRO buildings,
	   along with random door audits to check employees as they enter
	   un-staffed entrances.  
	   
	2) Unfortunately, the majority of theft reports are not received in
	   a timely fashion. This makes it almost impossible to resolve
	   some of these matters.

	3) In most instances, employees are not able to provide serial number
	   or asset tag numbers on the missing numbers. Even in cases where
	   recoveries have been made, we were unable to determine if it was
	   the equipment that was reported stolen due to the fact the serial
	   numbers could not be provided.

	4) In frequent cases, we find that there is no current back-up data
	   available for the employees to fall back on in the event of a theft
	   or equipment malfunction.

	5) Security in Marlboro has taken pro-active approach to illegal
           parking by ticketing etc.. This initiative has been supported by
	   VP level management and for good cause.  Digital is responsible to
	   make sure that the fire lanes and handicap parking are kept open
	   and available for it's intended use. Digital could be fined by the
	   city if the fire lanes are not kept open. Writing parking tickets
	   consumes very little time during the scheduled day, but 
	   unfortunately it is one of the most visible duties that the
	   officers perform.

	6) Security does resolve the majority of the cases that are
	   opened.  However, the results of these cases are not made known
	   to the public due to employee privacy issues.

	The following are a few helpful hints to all employees:

	A) Report all thefts immediately, to your local Security organization
	B) Document all assets within the group in as much detail as possible,
	   so if a theft does occur the items can be tracked.
	C) Back your standalone systems up on a frequent basis and keep the
	   data in a safe place.
	D) Report any suspicious activity/persons that may be with in your 
	   work area.  These often produce strong leads for investigations.
	E) Do not allow people to tailgate behind you at un-staffed entrances. 
	   As an employee of Digital you have every right to question someone 
	   for their photo badge if you are unsure if they should be entering 
	   a facility.
	F) Do not leave valuable or expensive software in vacant or unattended
	   office areas. 
	G) Do not leave valuable or expensive equipment (IE. PC's) in vacant 
	   or unattended offices.


	We encourage all employees to report information such that has been
	mentioned in the previous notes.  I am sad to say that I have received
	more information out of the previous notes, than I have received in
	the recent past for our theft reports. It is important for all 
	employees to aid in keeping our work place a safe and secure 
	environment.

Regards,
Dave
	 

I guess this means that with Pathworks network served disk drives, the only
thing the C: drive on your PC is good for is local caching of program files. All
you data files should go on a server disk that is regularly backed up.

I believe the LKG labs were losing small boards recently; now they are all
locked up and require keycard access. 'Course, probably most everyone in the
building has card access...

    
    RE:-14
    
    ****
	1) Security has taken a pro-active approach in the MRO area trying
	   to deter thefts such as the ones posted previously.  We have
	   restricted after hour access to all of the our MRO buildings,
	   along with random door audits to check employees as they enter
	   un-staffed entrances.  
    
    
  I think this is the biggest problem we have? we have doors open to anyone
    until 10pm with no security (other than NCS cards) from 6pm-10pm? 
    This just doesn't cut it? Anyone can walk out any of these doors with
    just about anything whether its concealed or not?  If the only reason 
    for having access to these doors is shorter walks to parking lots well
    someone missed the boat on that idea!
    
    
    Bill_who_could_use_the_longer_walk_anyways! 	 

    
    > -< Start cracking the whip! 
    
    an effective deterrent?

>I guess this means that with Pathworks network served disk drives, the only
>thing the C: drive on your PC is good for is local caching of program files. All
>you data files should go on a server disk that is regularly backed up.
    
    You should either be doing this or backing up the data yourself (either to
    the network drive or to tape) every day anyway. Theft isn't the only
    reason for data loss. Hard drives can fail. Hard drive controllers can
    screw up and trash your data. A virus can wipe out all your files.
    
    In field service, I see instances almost every day where a users hard drive
    no longer has any useful data on it. Most of them have *never* done a
    backup and just can't understand why the new hard drive doesn't have
    their programs on it, just like the old one did... :-(
    
    Harry
    

RE .12 - Just a thought for the paranoid...Maybe whoevever took your DESNC knew
*exactly* what they were getting, and don't care if they only have one. Maybe
there's another one somewhere they want to talk to and they already have the
key; they just need the other half of the lock. 

Back to my Tom Clancy novel...

    A few years ago, I moved to a field office that was
    co-located with another digital group.  Someone in
    the other group stole several manuals from my office.

    I went over and complained to one of the managers there,
    and HE LAUGHED AT ME.

    A few months later, the field service folks had been unable
    to fix an intermittent problem in a customer's MVII.  So,
    they brought the machine back to the office and left it
    running diagnostics over the weekend.

    During the weekend, someone stole the customers machine.
    The manager from a few paragraphs ago, then frantically runs
    around the building looking for the machine.

    I took great pleasure in seeing him screwed by the dishonest
    people he previously thought were so funny.  

    Vinidictive?  Me? Never.

    A sad story.. I had two roses stolen out of a vase of 6.  They
    were there when I left that night, gone in the morning (from MRO3).
    
    I called security to report it basically because it could have been
    something more important, and I wanted them to be aware someone was 
    pilfering through my office.  They were very receptive, and even
    filed a report.   

    Theft of equipment is nothing new.  I started working at Digital in
    1984 and was given a PRO350 for my desk.  During my first month 
    someone stole my hard drive. In 1988(or maybe 1987) I had one of the
    first CVAX based workstation in HLO(a VS3200).  I was asked to set it
    up in the lobby for a week so people could see a product with a CMOS
    processor. The week after it was moved back to my office the 
    processor, memory, video subsystem and disks were all stolen from it. I
    have seen everything from a mouse to an entire VS3500 go missing over
    my 10+ years with Digital.  
    
    -Bruce

RE: <<< Note 3429.14 by MROA::CULLEN >>>


>>	Well, being in Security for the MRO area I do have some concerns

>>	2) Unfortunately, the majority of theft reports are not received in
>>	   a timely fashion. This makes it almost impossible to resolve
>>	   some of these matters.

	The theft was reported on Tuesday and Security has yet to send
	a "investigator".  I think the trail is getting a little cold!  
	I mentioned a suspicion in my base note about who the theif might
	be but nobody from security IN MRO has done anything yet.  What
	is taking so long?  I called Security today and was told that
	within a week an investigator should be in touch.  So basically,
	the theft was reported in a timeley fashion but security is not
	responding in a timely fashion.  If this were my home, the police
	would already be investigating the theft!

>>	G) Do not leave valuable or expensive equipment (IE. PC's) in vacant 
>>	   or unattended offices.

	So, what do we do when our offices are "unattended" after hours?
	
	Karen

I forgot to mention...

Someone stole a banana from my office last Wednesday (the day before
the PC was gutted).  I wonder if it was the same person?  They probably
were casing out the area the night before, got hungry and wanted a
snack, ate my banana, then decided my office was "easy pickings" so
they went back the next night to gut the PC...

When I was working in MRO1, we had a 19" color workstation monitor disappear
without a trace.  Practitioners in my group legitimately borrowed the machine
from an office and put it in a common room which was usually, but not always,
locked.  While it was in the common room, someone swiped the monitor.  I was
not impressed with Security's reaction to our theft report, but that may have
been partly our group's fault, as we did not initially know the serial number.

Recently, in LKG1, some person or persons unknown stole a lot of memory from
a computer lab on the third floor.  The second and third floor labs had been
open during the day and keycard-locked at night - but now are keycard-locked
all the time.

Crackers (i.e., car thieves on the information superhighway, as opposed to the
innocuous MIT-type hackers) stole a very valuable piece of source code from us
over our network.  My information on this comes from an external publication -
so please don't try to tell me that this is secret information.  At the time,
we apparently could not be bothered to take simple measures to stop the theft.
Fortunately, these criminals did not make much use of the stolen source code.
Since then, I believe we have gone to the other extreme, and created a sort of
fortress mentality when it comes to network connections.  (And we appear to be
actively reducing the risk of software theft, by getting out of large parts of
the software business.  Thieves can only steal software that exists.)

Former DCU president and convicted fugitive from justice Mangone defrauded the
Digital Credit Union and Barnstable Credit Union of something like $18 million.
People attempting to run for the DCU Board of Directors on reform tickets have
generally won election in the end, but only after encountering DCU and Digital
behavior which has raised great questions in many people's minds.  (There is a
DCU Notesfile and an alt.digital.dcu newsgroup where you can find out more and
discuss this more; please don't start a rathole in this Notesfile.)

There were two swindling stories that made the paper:

    1. I remember a report of a criminal felony trial in which a defendant
       had extreme trouble convincing a jury that parking a car many blocks
       away from a Digital warehouse at midnight, going around to the back
       of the warehouse, and removing many valuable circuit boards without
       written authorization was legitimate business behavior.  :-)   This
       defense is so amazingly duplicitious and inept that the story is an
       obvious candidate for the GOLDEN_TURKEY notesfile.  As I recall, the
       jury did not buy the story, and convicted him of the felony.

    2. I remember a report of a scam in which a third party which had some
       legitimate contract to (dispose of?  salvage?) broken Digital parts
       was turning around and selling those parts to our customers in some
       way that sounded like misrepresentation, fraud against the customer,
       and breach of contract with Digital all rolled into one nice package.
       I believe the people involved in this scam were also convicted, and
       that this story received front-page coverage in one of our internal
       wide-distribution newspapers or newsletters (Digital This Week?).

The savings and loan fraud is a scam against all of us.  You, me, and Digital
will be paying taxes for 30 years while most of the assholes who masterminded
those frauds get away scot-free.

During the time that I've been working for Digital, these are the only thefts
related to work that I've heard about.  All of these are terrible and reflect
poorly on society.  However, during this time period, a criminal or criminals
unknown broke into my apartment.  Police think the guy was a career criminal,
looking for money to feed his drug habit (I think this is non-specific enough
and far enough removed in time not to hurt their detectives' chances).  Another
tenant who was living there at the time later told me that almost all of the
apartments there had been burglarized within a few months preceding & following
my experience.  I suppose it could have been different criminals, but after
what the police told me, my personal opinion was that it was the same person
or persons, and that he, she, or they were really on a roll.  :-(

Considering that Digital has tens of thousands of times more employees than my
household has people, Digital may actually have gotten off rather lightly!  Of
course, there are probably many other thefts of which I am unaware.  Companies
don't always like to publicize these things when they happen - particularly if
the companies in question are banks.

Microprocessor chips, laptop computers, lab tools, and tapes full of computer
data are so small and so valuable that there is no practical way to absolutely
prevent their theft.  I, for one, would not work for a company that forced me
to submit to a body search or personal belongings search, and short of a very
intrusive, anti-American security policy, you are not going to get rid of all
the opportunities people have to smuggle valuables out the door.  I strongly
believe that our current Internet firewalls against TELNET use are unjustified
and counterproductive.  They make Mosaic unreliable; they prevent our use of
any public Internet service offered in the TELNET fashion; and there are other
ways that thieves can attack us if they are determined to do us harm.

Even if you imposed military-style security, thieves who have a great deal to
gain (such as the Intel 486 armed robbers) can always attempt to find bribable
people in the security force - and again, it only takes one or two.  Treating
employees in general as people who want to be honest, and as professionals who
should be trusted and respected is the best policy.  Not only is it ethically
right, but it puts employees on your side, giving you a big pool of watchdogs.

This doesn't mean leaving huge piles of 300 MHz Alpha AXP chips unguarded in a
public lobby.     :-)

    Well, I worked in Security  at three sites for six years. At the last
    site, we had received several reports of thefts taking place after
    hours. We placed cameras in several locations and had them feed a
    time-lapse vcr. We were able to capture the thieves on tape the first
    night. We took the tape to Personnel (it was still Personnel in those
    days) in accordance with procedure. We were told by the Personnel
    manager that the Digital employees couldn't be fired this time because
    "no one ever specifically told them that stealing was wrong and against
    Digital policy". But now that they had been officially told, the NEXT
    time, they would be fired. This is a true story - I was involved from
    beginning to end. I left Security shortly thereafter to pursue another
    career path.
    
    BTW: Guess who was a personal friend of the Personnel manager and
    "performed many helpful duties around the facility"?

>Someone stole a banana from my office last Wednesday (the day before
>the PC was gutted).

They liked the banana so much that went back for some chips.

> 
> This doesn't mean leaving huge piles of 300 MHz Alpha AXP chips unguarded in a
> public lobby.     :-)

Hey, that might be one way we can achieve volume in the marketplace.

    Theft is nothing new. I had a complete office minus the chair removed
    from me, piecemeal. I kept telling my managers about things missing
    day after day. They laughed. Then one day I walk into my cube and the
    only thing left in the middle of the cube, was a mag tape, my chair
    and my phone hookup. My *locked* desk and *locked* file cabinet
    were gone. Everyone had a nice laugh. Seems my cube was in the middle
    of a territory battle over space.
    
    -Mike Z.
    Digital Consulting

    
    RE.30
    
    I work in the mill in an enclosed area.  It had two doors with
    combination locks.  Facilities removed them 6 weeks ago.  Since
    then offices have been easy pickings.
    
    I worked at River Rd in Andover just before it closed down.  Anyone
    care to get what was stolen?  The front end loader used to do ground
    work.  I'm not talking a sit down mower.  This was a huge, yellow,
    front end loader with the scoop in front and back.  
    
    In defense of security, they were all sent to "other" jobs.  The temp
    security was in charge.  Never heard if it ever turned up.  I was
    contacted by security several times, ie capital asset...
    
    Mark
     

    Re .6
    
    >It's only going to get worse.  A 2Gb RZ28 disk measures 2x4x6 andcan be
    >used on most any computer around, including home PC's.  
    
     This behavior is not 'new'. I remember someone cleaning out 16 disk
    controller cards (approximately 16" x 18") from 2 LIVE HSC70's in MRO1 
    back in '88. How (and why) were these snuck out? Some people just have 
    no respect for property belonging to others, and their morals are lowered 
    even further when 'they need it for their job'
    
    Re .15
    
    >I believe the LKG labs were losing small boards recently; now they are
    >all locked up and require keycard access. 'Course, probably most everyone
    >in the building has card access...
    
     The 'small boards' were about 512mb of (not_very_inexpensive) memory
    which was removed from LIVE systems and IN THE MIDDLE OF a business day! 
    And, not 'everyone' has access but now we know who enters the lab and next 
    time, people will be questioned. This should also give incentive to not 
    allow 'tailgating' through key-card controlled areas because the person 
    you let through could cause you a lot of discomfort if something should 
    be reported missing.
    
     I am not from security but DO believe that 'security' is the
    responsibility of ALL employees. Avoiding the issue could cost you, or
    someone else, a job. Who pays for the 512mb of memory that has to be
    purchased to replace what was stolen? I don't know what person's name
    was attached to that line on the budget but it probably meant there 
    wasn't enough money to keep an engineer employed for the rest of the 
    year.
    
     Thefts are much more frequent than anyone seems to indicate here, it's
    just that nobody advertises them. The thief is quiet for obvious reasons,
    and security remains quiet to investigate. I hear of missing laptops,
    disks & boarsd and good hardware replaced with broken/bad hardware on
    a fairly frequent basis. Not to mention the amount software (especially
    for PCs) which is quietly stolen every day.
    
     Be diligent, question strangers in your office area, get security
    involved and most importantly, act like a 'dog with a new bone' when it 
    comes to protecting the assets assigned to you. Instead of thinking that
    it belongs to Digital Equip. Corp. treat it like a house that belongs
    to you AND the bank. Eventually, most people will become afraid to (even 
    honestly) go near your equipment without your permission. DON'T give up, 
    the job you save, may be your own!!!
    
    
    Glenn

    
    	RE: .0
    
    	I can relate to your situation. My job is to process excess
        equipment out of ZKO. I have had sealed D-Containers broken open to
    	find out what is in them. At times I will have equipment lined up to
        be shipped to PDC and encountered employees taking parts out of the 
    	equipment because they think that they have the right to take what
    	they need. The response is that the equipment is being scrapped is it
    	not. What they don't understand is that if the equipment has
        Capital still attached to it. That PDC will not recieve it and the
    	Cost Center that owns will not be able to write it off. This is a 
    	different scenario than yours. But the end result is the same. One
        Center Center getting resources at the expense of an other. There
        are two ways of looking at it. You can look at the employee as a theif
    	or as being resourceful. Your right in the sense that the issue
        needs to be addressed. 

    
    
re- **   In defense of security, they were all sent to "other" jobs.  The temp
    ** security was in charge.  Never heard if it ever turned up.  I was
    ** contacted by security several times, ie capital asset...
    
    
    
Well this seems to be happening alot lately, with the security groups
    having the same pressures applied to them as other orgs they seem to be
    downsizing at an alarming rate. I'm not sure of numbers but I would
    have guess that the security staff at MRO is more TEMP than employees?
    
    now this strategy of outsorurcing service works great for some things but
    by putting security in the hands of 'low cost contract security' a.k.a
    "rent-a-cops" (nothing personal my dad does it parttime also!) I think
    you may jeopardize some of the reasons we have security. Again we
    aren't selling candy from candy store, we are in a High Tech Industy with
    expensive products, tools and secrets and we should remember that when
    a temp security guard with little training now handles security for a
    major exit in a high tech building?
    
    just my .02$
    
    BS

    .29
    
    My cubee had his sports back taken a couple of days ago.  The thief
    took a banana out of the bag then took the bag.

    Well, it even happens in Dallas, I'm afraid. (Although in the recent
    move, someone tried to LEAVE a DecPro 350 in my office.  You ever tried
    to get rid of one of those things? :^]).
    
    Someone actually stole the memory out of one of the PCs.  Did a nice
    job, put the whole thing back together and rebooted.  Theft was
    discovered when Windows s-t-a-r-t-e-d  r-u-n-n-i-n-g  s-l-o-w.  The sad
    part is, there's now a little nagging voice in the back of your mind
    when you meet someone new that say "Maybe them, maybe them..."
    
    A co-worker said it's most prevalent around lay-off time.  My office
    has one paper clip, two mainila folders, and a rubber band we're
    guarding jealously.  the loss of any one item represents a 25% drop in
    available office supplies :^]

��	responding in a timely fashion.  If this were my home, the police
��	would already be investigating the theft!

    In many communities, here on my planet, for a small theft
    such as this, you would be invited to come to the cop-house
    and fill out a report.  The cops would use this report to
    wipe up jelly that spilled from their next donut, and would
    tell you to call your insurance company.

    Investigate?  Right...

re .35:

There's a difference between stealing for personal gain and stealing because
you need equipment to do your job for Digital.  The former is caused by greed,
the latter by red tape.

	People quit stealing my lunch after I sabotaged it a few times.  After I
let them know what they've eaten. They tend to stop taking from me and move on
to the next target. I assume they found the chips very salty.


 Keith

    re .40
    
    I'm reminded of something my grandmother taught me..."two wrongs don't
    make a right."  
    
    Red tape doesn't "cause" stealing. 
    
    People choose to steal.
    
    It's still illegal and immoral, regardless of whether bureaucracy
    exists or not.
    
    Lynn

I knew I shouldn't have left out the sentence about red tape not justifying
stealing.

    Re .40
    
    >There's a difference between stealing for personal gain and stealing because
    >you need equipment to do your job for Digital.  The former is caused bygreed,
    >the latter by red tape.
    
     The 'difference' is called RATIONALIZING. The effect is STILL the same 
    the thief gains property, the victim loses property & money and we ALL
    lose trust in our co-workers, not to mention lost productivity worrying
    about and trying to prevent the situation. I find this rationalizing
    (and acceptance) of even petty theft to be a VERY sad commentary on our
    society. 
    
    
     Is it okay for the unemployed next door neighbor to 'borrow' your car
    because he's unemployed and needs it more than you??? If you believe that 
    then don't come looking to 'borrow' my car, you may find that I bypass
    the 'red tape' and you find yourself being rationalized by a powerful 
    projectile related mechanism instead of my opinions in a NOTES conference.
    
    
    Glenn

    Re .41
    
    Reminds me of a story I heard on the radio...
    
    Seems this guy's lunch kept getting stolen out of the fridge
    at work [by a coworker].  So his wife scrapped the chocolate
    off a chocolate eclair and replaced it with X-LAX.  By mid-
    afternoon, they knew the culprit.
    
    She called the radio station to "confess".

Hi again,

	I really do not want this thing to turn into a slug fest, and
	in some ways I think it already has.  There has been alot of items 
	mentioned in the previous notes that are very true and some that are 
	not. Unfortunately we live in a society where crimes such as these
	occur on a much to frequent basis.  As someone pointed
	out a few notes back, Security is everyone's job.  Digital has always
	been a company that trusts it's employees.  When you allow some of
	the freedoms we have all been blessed with, you have to expect some
	negative results. These results seldom outweigh the positive attributes 
	and benefits, but are highly visible.  Because of these highly visible 
	events, the perception is that every Digital facility is experiencing
	high rates of theft. This is not true.

	Prior to the PC revolution, thefts were not as personal as they are
	today.  Most of the thefts occurred in the larger computer lab 
	environments.  Today, since the lab is now sitting within our office
	cube, the thefts seem to be much more prevalent/personal. In fact, they
	may not be occurring at any greater rate than they were 10 years ago.


Regards

    Last Thursday we had a Mac system box stolen from an office at ZKO. It
    happened sometime after 6:30 pm (after the office was vacated for the
    day). Whoever STOLE it, left the keyboard, cables, and monitor. 
    
    How about a LoJack for computers?

    I think I'm gonna add some concealed ID numbers to my stuff before
    I move.. 
    
    ...tom

    
    Maybe we should start putting pictures of missing equipment on the
    sides of the milk cartons sold on Digital cafeterias?
    
    ;-)
    

	re:-46
    
    ****When you allow some of the freedoms we have all been blessed with, you 
        have to expect some negative results. These results seldom outweigh the
        positive attributes and benefits, but are highly visible.  Because of 
        these highly visible events, the perception is that every Digital 
        facility is experiencing high rates of theft. This is not true.
    
    
    Well my question is should we have freedoms like unmanned doors
    afterhours? is this really a freedom? or just lack of man power?
    also I've noticed with so many 'non digital' personnell running 
    around our sites (networking,cleaners,vendors,Telco,etc..) this just 
    changes the old 'DEC' were we all were employees and anyone else
    needed an escort? Well today it seems some non employees have more
    access than most of us (I realize they need it to get their work done)
    but with this change in envirnoment dont you think we should change our
    philosophy in security? 
    
    BS

    RE. -47
    
    About two years ago in BXB we had a MAC system box stolen from the 
    building over a weekend, the thieves left the keyboard, cables, 
    and montior also.  
    
    When Security checked the tape of who entered the building over the
    weekend, they discovered that the theft was committed by 2 NINJAs.
    
    I'm not joking - Security had pictures of two persons entering the
    building dressed in Ninja costumes.
    
    -Carla

    
    There are security devices available to physically bar access to
    a PC or system enclosure.  There are small radio devices, about the
    size of (and disguised as) an IC chip, that can be placed within
    PC's that will trigger an alarm if attempted to moved past sensors
    at exits.  Perhaps Digtal facilities should consider doing a risk/loss
    assessment regarding purchasing these items?
    

This was a pretty "interesting" theft in UFC (Munich).  Coworker had 2 RZ55's
shipped over from the U.S. - not much use as the power supplies were not
switched.  One day they dissapeared...  Apparently the thief figured out
the problem and returned to exchange the disks with the blow power supplies
with another coworker's in an adjacent office.  I guess he/she must have had
some sort of conscience as they actually took the time to swap the disks so
the second victim was left with his disks in the cabinets with the blown
power supplies.  He called field service - imagine what they thought after
hearing "don't know what happened - they worked yesterday" and looking in to 
see 110 volt power supplies.

    A few months ago I came in a little earlier than usual (5:30 am) and
    found a person in a compromising position with our coffee fund's money
    box.  Though the evidence was cicumstantial and I did not see him
    actually steal anything -- I did not see the person actually remove any
    money and he said he was looking for change and there was change in the
    box though he was using a couple of stir sticks on the slot with the
    box in an upright position (If one is attempting to retrieve change
    from a piggy bank one turns it over -- the upright position indicates
    to me that he was trying to get some bills out not coins ), as well as
    the fact that this individual should have known that change machines
    exist all over the ZK complex, and the fact that the person had a huge
    wad of bills in his pocket, etc.
    
    I reported the problem and received no real response.  I think he
    doesn't work here anymore but I'm not sure.  In any event, we
    (the coffee fund mgmt) have instituted a much more regular
    schedule of emptying the cash boxes and are now experiencing only
    the usual pilferage of coffee instead of theft of cash.
    
    ed                                                               

    Sociologists (and the ACLU) are fond of saying things like "Well, your
    Honor, He (she) can't really be blamed for his (her) behaviour.  He
    (she) was abused while there!"
    
    Wonder if Digital's abuse of its employees contributes?
    
    tony

    FWIW, I had a buddy that I worked with back when I supported a nuclear
    facility.  He kept his lunch in a common refrigerator.  Things would
    sometimes be missing from his lunch.  Someone might take a few bites
    out of his sandwich.  Someone might take a few of his chips or cookies.
    That kind of thing.  We figured it was probably intimidation from union 
    folks.  (We, being engineers, were not in the union.)
    
    So, one day he packed a batch of "chocolate" brownies.  There was, of
    course, a substantial dose of Exlax in the brownies.  To his surprise, 
    whoever it was took *all* of the brownies.  We never heard what
    happened, but whoever it was didn't steal any more of his lunch.
    
    Steve

    
    What's EXLAX ?
    

Use your imagination :-))!

    
    It's a medicine that makes you UH! go UH!  You know, it, it's like
    drinking a lot of prune juice!
    
    Jim Morton

    It teaches you how to do the green apple two-step. ;)

    
    
    After you have it you are like the energizer bunny.....
    
    
    
    you keep, going and going and going and going.... :')

    Re .61
    	But if you take Prozak also, you'll be happy about going and going
    and ....
    

 re: .55
   � Sociologists (and the ACLU) are fond of saying things like "Well, your
   � Honor, He (she) can't really be blamed for his (her) behaviour.  He
   � (she) was abused while there!"
 
I can imagine a sociologist making such an argument under some circumstance,
but the ACLU?  I'd like to see an example referenced.  The ACLU defends civil 
liberties, i.e, those guaranteed by the U.S. Constitution.

I always find it interesting to see someone use such a technique to take a shot
at someone or thing with which he or she disagrees (or has been "taught" to 
disagree).

Bruce

    I agree with .63. Sounds like .55 is a victim of the ACLU and therefore
    the blame lies with the ACLU.
    

re: "...green apple two-step"

    Is it easier to cut expenses by taking measures to curb theft and
    fire theives or by laying off a few more people? (who may or may not
    be the ones stealing)
    
    mm

    re .41
    
>	People quit stealing my lunch after I sabotaged it a few times.  After I
>let them know what they've eaten. They tend to stop taking from me and move on
>to the next target. I assume they found the chips very salty.
    
    Guuuuuu-FAAAAAWWWWWWW!  Did you...ummmmm....do what I think you
    did!?!?!?!?!  
    
    							Tex

This may be an isolated case in my office (Phoenix, AZ), but a PCMCIA 14.4 
Fax/Modem card was lifted out of my packed boxes in a preparation to move from 
PHX to a home office environment.  Due to my only being able to pack during the 
after hours/weekends, I attempted to follow rules and not remove any of the 
property until I was able to get to the office during "normal business hours", 
hence several weeks passed with my boxes filled and exposed.

A report was filed promptly and the facilities manager "passed the word" around 
the office.  The piece of equipment was still in the box, still unopened and 
brand new!  The facilities manager _hoped_ that the thief would have a change 
of heart and "sneak" it back in my drawer.  Well much to my amazement and 
during the days I showed up to properly remove the boxes/equipment, a "last 
check" of the (already cleared out) drawers showed the PCMCIA card in an empty 
drawer--still unopened!!!  The theif apparently did have a change of heart 
and/or feared that the tapes of video surveillance would make them a star.

I feel that the tapes should still be played and the person should still be 
prosecuted.  I reported back to corporate security that the item had been 
returned, and have not received any follow-up call back.  Which brings up the 
point:  How many thefts go UNREPORTED??!!  I'd imagine that there is a far 
greater number of unreported thefts--especially since this is a "self-insured" 
company and that filing a report can been a crimp on time.  

Just a note/observation:  In civilian society, a police report is simply an
inconvenience to the police departments, but required by insurance companies if
you are to place a claim.  Insurance companies hope that a law abiding citizen
would fear that filing a false police report would carry more penalty than
defrauding the insurance company from said false report, I guess. 

Re:  a couple back...keep the ACLU out of this notes conference--they can take 
up an entire disk of space and it would be a rathole herein.  

Jesse

P.S.  I know the term "dittohead" commonly is used as a Limbaugh-jargon, but
can someone explain what the term dittohead means and where it derived?  I know 
this is a minkhole (a rathole, but it feels good), but it is being used loosely 
in this note.
                                                         

    >>>>   P.S.  I know the term "dittohead" commonly is used as a 
    >>>>   Limbaugh-jargon, but can someone explain what the term 
    >>>>   dittohead means and where it derived?  

    Dittohead means someone who believes without proof or reason anything
    someone says, no matter how outrageous, biased, or ridiculous

    Term originated with Rush

    - John
                                                         

    >Dittohead means someone who believes without proof or reason anything
    >someone says, no matter how outrageous, biased, or ridiculous
     
    Rush uses this term because his detractors "think" that those who
    listen/"follow" just "rubberstamp" everything he says (they don't)
    and because he exposes absurdity by being absurd!
    
    Many of those who agree with him, have been saying the same things
    he has been saying with regard to conservativism long before he was
    even around.  He has just given the conservatives "equal time" when
    compared to the main stream media hype/garbage.  And no, I don't
    "ditto" EVERYTHING he says (just 99.94%)
    
    Yes, this can be be a canyon not a rathole!!    
    
    Mike Austin
    
    Question why are liberals so "afraid" of him?  Could it be he is RIGHT?
    And if you read your Bible, Ecclesiastes 10:2 says:
    "A wise man's heart tends to the right; but a fool's heart to the
    left."

    
    Now I know why I'm so glad and motiovated after every DVN !
    
    
    					D.I.TTohead 

Re .70 - To the right and left of what? These are relative terms, not absolute.
The ancient Romans probably thought of Christ as a stinkin' liberal left-winger,
while we revere him. 

    Boy, when you start mixing religion with politics, and
    widdershins with deosil, who knows what to expect?
    
    
    NO ONE EXPECTS....
    
    			THE SPANISH INQUISITION!
    
    

    re: -1
    
    Notes is like a box of chocolates...you never know what you're gonna
    get. :^)
    
    

    re: -1
    
    Notes is like a dirty litterbox.  The user's gotta scratch through a
    lotta sh*t to find their happy spot. :^]
    
    							Tex

    Widdershins = counterclockwise. deosil = clockwise.
    
    Bright Blessings,
    
    PJ

    Widdershins = counterclockwise

Really?  I thought it was "withershins"....
...ah, withershins is a variant of widdershins
...just looked it up in Websters.

It was one of the words I used in a dictionary word game I once played.

 Speaking of theft...I passed around a card for a departing employee, tossing
 a few bucks in as did other people.  The card is still around...money is
 gone.



Jim

    >>>>   P.S.  I know the term "dittohead" commonly is used as a 
    >>>>   Limbaugh-jargon, but can someone explain what the term 
    >>>>   dittohead means and where it derived?  
    
    I was under the impression that the term "dittohead" started some time
    ago, when people would call Rush's show, before they talked about
    something of interest, they would go on and on about how much they
    enjoyed his show, etc.  Finally, someone called just said "ditto what
    the previous caller said", thereby saving some time.  The "ditto"
    caught on, and how there are people calling in with "megadittos",
    "gigadittos", "mega-motor-city-dittos" (from Detroit, MI, USA callers). 
    It's gotten really silly, if you ask me.
    
    Well, the liberals caught up on this, and adjusted the meaning of
    "ditto" as the blind agreement with whatever Rush had to say, and
    "dittohead" meaning a person who blindly agrees with Rush.
    
    	Stu

    
    liberals often act as if they assume that *any* agreement 
    with Rush make one an unquestioning dittohead by definition
    (as well as a skull full of mush by extension).
    

    It is said, if your a child and you're not liberal you do not have a heart,
    if you mature and you're not a conservative then you do not have a mind!

What has all this to do with employee theft?

>What has all this to do with employee theft?

It seems to me that politics has STOLEN the note.
And speaking of politics, many may not realize that the word 
comes from a combination of words: Poli meaning many, and tics meaning
blood-sucking parasites.  (Toungue out of cheek, now.)

MM

    I think the implication is that all the dittoheads that view Rush
    Limbaugh are responsible for it.  Or is it that all the foolish young
    liberals are walking away with the place?  Or could it be that theft
    knows no ideology?  Now *I'm* confused too!
    
    To add to discussion about theft, I've had personal copies of books
    taken off my shelf, also user manuals (Microsoft, not Digital).  I also
    manage a coffee fund and constantly find people helping themselves to
    the coffee and depositing pennies or a nickel to pay for it, if they pay
    at all.  I think one of the by-products of the type of environment we
    are in is that people start to develop a "me first" attitude. 
    Management needs to be careful about setting the tone for this or it
    will really get out of hand.
    
    lt

    I agree!!!!!!  All I wanted was a *_simple_* definition of dittohead,
    not an all out rathole/war of liberal vs conservative disscussion.  Sorry I
    asked the question.
    
    Jesse

If you subscribe to the belief that contractors are more likely to commit petty
theft than employees due to a lesser sense of loyalty to the company, as some of
the replies here would indicate (and I don't agree, having started off with
Digital as a contractor), what does it mean for Digital to move to the "virtual
workforce"? Yesterday a valued employee, tomorrow a disposable cog in the
corporate machine. Such an environment would seem to foster an
in-it-for-whatever-I-can-get attitude, driving a deeper wedge between "us" (the
worker bees) and "them" (the management). If our sense of belonging to the team
helps keep us honest, will theft begin to rise and level off at a high rate? I
think a contractor hired with the original expectation of being a contractor is
no more likely to steal than an employee, but what about the embittered former
employee/now contractor who feels the company is taking his security away?

   
   Just yesterday, in MR3, a co-worker had over $100 stolen from her
   wallet during lunch.  She hadn't locked her desk.  My wallet was
   fortunately with me at lunch!  I begin to wonder if the Pentium
   components were stolen in MR3, not MR4 as originally suspected!

   Karen

re .87

Honesty has NOTHING to do with (1) job code/classification (2) 
temporary/permanent (3) liberal/conservative.

It boils down to "Are YOU honest or not?", -- what is your moral fiber?

You will find your crooks in any grouping of people (don't take that 
literally - I realize a group of Mother Theresa clones wouldn't qualify). 
I believe it also has little to do with "me first" or "look what they are 
doing to us".  If you are honest you don't steal -- that all!

Stu, there's never been a change in meaning.  It just took somebody who
dislikes Limbaugh to teach dittoheads what they were doing/saying.

BobW

>================================================================================
>Note 3429.79                     Employee Theft                         79 of 89
>GLDOA::FULLER "Never confuse a memo with reality"    18 lines  11-OCT-1994 22:38
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>                         -< The origin of "dittohead" >-
>
>    Well, the liberals caught up on this, and adjusted the meaning of
>    "ditto" as the blind agreement with whatever Rush had to say, and
>    "dittohead" meaning a person who blindly agrees with Rush.
>    
>        Stu

    
    it does relate to theft...the liberal pols have been stealing my money
    for years!
    
    

    the conservative banking industry gets its share too...
    
    ed

    Enough!  Back to the original topic, please.
    
    			Steve

    There are a few Deccies still here in the Quantum building (SHR1). 
    Quantum provides free hot beverages to all employees, both in the 
    cafeteria and at coffee stations. They have been generous in
    allowing the Deccies to share this benefit. 
    
    Every morning the cafeteria workers bring two containers of ground
    coffee to each coffee station upstairs. Yesterday, withing ten minutes
    of her delivery, one of the containers was already missing. This was
    not the first time coffee disappeared. As of today the free coffee at 
    this coffee statton is terminated. 
    
    Linda  

    
    
    
    I cannot believe what I am reading in this string.  I guess I can
    believe it, but good grief, do people really think that this stuff is
    okay?
    

No.  But I'm sure that those who perpetrate these crimes have a pile of
excuses and rationalizations they'll trot out if you ever manage to confront
them about it.  We are rapidly developing into a society of individuals who
lack respect for others.

					Steve

    If they are caught they will complain that it is not their fault. 
    Society and/or Digital forced them into it so they are not guilty.
    
    Dennis

    It...it wasn't my fault.  I had a troubled childhood.  I come from a
    broken family.  My father never hugged me.  The school system in
    America has broken down.  I've got Attention Deficit Disorder.  I've
    been discriminated against.  Theft is part of my culture.  It's not
    fair that you've got one and I don't.  The government should be
    subsidizing them anyway.  You'd do the same thing, if you were in my
    shoes.  I was just borrowing it, it's not like I was stealing it or
    something.  The company owes me big-time, and I'm never gonna get it. 
    Palmer gets a raise and stock, I get squat (OK, scratch that one).  No
    one was using it anyway, it was just going to waste.  Remember you told
    me I could have it?
    
         (Those of us with kids will recognize SEVERAL of the above)
    
    "Dogbert's Clues for the Clueless": when you hear of someone letting
    people get away with something, get there quick before all the good
    stuff's gone!  "Hey, you aren't even USING all these internal organs!
    Gllrrmpphfff!"
    
    								Tex

    
    Now I know why I yearn for the days of yesteryear when we just hung the
    horsethieves. Probably explains everything....
    
    		the Greyhawk

    re: .96 (Steve Lionel)
    
<	 We are rapidly developing into a society of individuals who
<	lack respect for others.
    
    and we seem now to also be a society of individuals who fail to accept
    responsibility for our own actions... and the consequences.
    
    tony

    Theft of physical possessions should not exist, ... but it does. 
     
    BEWARE ... How about a DIGITAL telephone operator who listened to an 
    incoming call that I received !! This is eavesdropping (sp) and is theft 
    as well. Theivery of rights, theft of confidential information can be 
    more damaging than theft of a calculator, and especially by someone in 
    such a position or by somebody who has the ability to listen in on 
    anybody's phone conversation. I was beside myself. I simply wanted to
    reach through the phone and simply choke her.
    
    I reported it to Corp. Security, and esentially was told that a
    communications was issued to the department. I am told that the operators 
    were informed that they shouldn't listen in any more. What a relief, 
    DEC 5-O in action at its best.
    

    Here in LIO Weve got a VAX Station II GPX we Wish someone would steal! :-)

    A small reply from your nation's capital....
    Barrytown, D.C..........
                                                        
    crime in the Suburbs.... my, my, my....
                                    
    
    If some wants to "lift" something.. get me an LA36... I trying to 
    emulate the 'Coors' "We can rebuild 'm. We can make 'm better, 
    better than before."
    
    Saw this note ... I don't think it's funny but it's really sad to think
    someone will take equipment or property from another person trying
    to feed their family too. 
    
    To those who would want to steal, bring your sticky fingers down to
    good 'ol D.C. We have plenty of guys in jail named BUBBA who are
    looking for a few good men to trade for cigarettes.
    
    And don't think our jails aren't politicaly correct. For the
    light-fingered females, FRANKIE would love to have you for a wife..
    
    If I sound bitter, I am, because I don't understand employee theft.
    If you study the words 'employee theft', it means all employees 
    suffer from internal theft. You remove $2K worth of equipment someone's
    raise has to replace it. If you remove someone's personal property,
    this jerk doesn't realize this action only adds to our slumping
    moral problem. 
    
    But a theiving jerk doesn't care about the above paragraph. But if 
    the thief gets caught (and they will in most cases, not always
    directly), but we had a thief in my old office, every one knew this
    person stole, life within DEC (not Digital) was made so misarable for
    him, he quit, went to Third Party, stole a PC from a customer and got
    3 years for theft. 
    
    So keep on stealing and you won't need a dress for you next
    wedding....... just bring those Camel's with you.. and don't drop
    that SOOOOOOOOOOOAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAP!

Here in the UK theft appears to be encouraged. As people leave by the bus 
load, there are many cases of equipment being scavenged by waiting 
vultures. Our asset register was never very accurate, it's probably a 
complete joke now. This kind of lax behaviour leads to problems later when 
people feel it's the norm in our culture to help themselves to whatever 
they need (or fancy).

We've also had very lax property removal processes. Anyone can ship 
equipment off site by filling in the appropriate forms, which can lack 
detail if you use your imagination (n boxes). 

Dave.

    A manager told me yesterday that they've been having a theft problem
    in his area so they set up surveilance cameras, but security told
    them not to, on the grounds that Digital could be sued big time if
    pictures are taken of employees without their permission!  He didn't
    understand how we can have cameras on the parking lots if that is
    true, but didn't get a clear answer from his local security.
    
    If anyone has information about this, please post a reply.  There's
    no need to encourage anyone to post speculations...
    
    	Thanks,
    	Larry

    
       Larry,
    
          I'm not sure about that statement, but if it is true, perhaps
       it is the "hidden" versus the "obviously seen" issue.  I can see
       the camera's on the parking lot, therefore I am aware of their 
       use, while a hidden camera I would not.  On the other hand, an
       employer has the right to protect their assets which in my mind
       can go way beyond what Digital does today (look at other companies
       as previously mentioned in this string).
    
          I think you can be sued for anything these days, but I'm sure
       a lot would get thrown out by the courts as frivilous or
       unreasonable.
    
          Just some thoughts,
                            Mark

    
    
    
        SUBSCRIBERS:@A1@KAO
    
    CC:  PETER HUNT @MSO
    CC:  TONY GENTILUCCI @MSO
    
    Subject: (I) ROBERT BENSON
    
        On May 5th, 1994, after a cooperative investigation between Digital
        Protective Services and the Ontario Provincial Police, contract
        employee Robert BENSON was arrested and charged with two counts of
        possession of stolen property and two counts of theft over
        $1000.00.
    
        BENSON has since pleaded guilty to the charges and will be
        sentenced on
        November 17.
      
                    

    
    Now, if we can do the same thing with Bob Palmer and company, we'll be
    all set! They've been stealing from us for about three years now!
    
    This does not justify employee theft, but could be considered a kind
    of theft in it's own right.
    
    IMHO.
    
    chet
    
    

    regarding 109.......... bet you stole some cpu cycles on that one!
    
    
    ;^)  
    
    P/T

    
    were we in the same class at North Eastern......??????
    
    bravo   .109
    
    bc
    
    

    
    	And I thought I was a trip at the Dinner Table. This guy is all
    over these notes files. Must have a cast of 000's.
    
    		the Greyhawk

Re Thomas Darwin Newton...

I haven't laughed so much for a long, long time; keep it up - I think that
it's about time the notes file was lifted from doom and gloom to
a scene from TRON II.

I presume that Thomas has been sucked down into the NET ( he works for the 
Networks Group ) by RP and is now surfing around at warp speed placing
notes all over the place and generally causing organised chaos.

Who is going to save him - The Greyhawk?
 

      .109 sounds a lot like psycho-history in Asimov's "Foundation" books.

    
    	Save Newton. Hell, if he's not plagarizing, I'm his Agent.
    Hollywood here we come. Maybe we'll start with a WWW piece, contact the
    NYTimes, slip a few tidbits to the gossip columnists, start something
    BIG.....
    
    			the Greyhawk

    I wouldn't mind but his habit of Capitalising every Seemingly
    unimportant or Irrelevant word winds Me up like a Spring!
    
    Calvin

Overnight, someone took my Alpha baseball cap, one of the
original ones with the multicolored logo.

:-(

    Clearly a problem with the new slogan.  It must be interpreted
    internally as "Whatever, Take it"

	... in 1990. The Atlanta facilities had transitioned to the new 
Alpharetta facility and a downtown high-rise for the Southeast District 
Sales/Services in August '89. Our group had a VAX 3500 with a Vaxstation head 
that we used for a "sandbox", and it sat under a worksurface in someone's cube.
One night, I logged in from home in the early evening for a few minutes, then 
off. Later in the evening, I tried again but got "service not reachable..." 
from the server. The next morning, we found the CPU gone, but the display still 
there! And this was on the 22nd floor, with elevator service restricted after 
6PM! A 3500 was NO lightweight! We never found it. Figured it was well hidden 
in some unused part of the building until elevator access was available.

	Immediately after this incident, cameras/recorders were installed, and 
within 2 months they caught a PC thief(employee!) in the act. 

    Had our toshiba laptop which we used on line in the fabs for
    downloading information to the equipment stolen a couple of months
    back. Seems like if it's not nailed down it's fair game here. Sad 
    but true....
    
    Bw

Coworker reported set of Oracle manuals stolen last week.

This very morning a collegue had 8MB of SIMM stolen from inside his PC.
They would have taken all 16MBs, but one block was behind the disks,
so was probably too difficult to lift discretely.

Oh well, that blows away our ability to run WNT!!!

mb

    I work at PKO3... 
    I've noticed a very big drop in security here.  They layed off most of
    the "old timer" security types a few months ago.  
    Now, with the massive influx of
    engineers here, security (in the form of checking stuff when you exit)
    is spotty at best... and the locked doors which separated the
    "customer" access areas from the "employee" access areas are now left
    unlocked nearly all the time.  
    
    tony

	When I worked in the Digital Puerto Rico plants, every bag
	was checked going in and out. No problems, minor complaints,
	and it was done 100% of the time.

	Of course this only stops removal of large stolen objects. Boards,
	chips, etc. wouldn't be noticed especially in some of the deep
	pockets of brief cases.

	There will always be theft, lets just try to make it a little harder.
	
	- John

The guards at G Building of Raytheon in Waltham frequently asked to look
inside my empty thermos bottle as I was leaving.

I didn't like it.

Art

    I was part of a development team at a major client site some years ago.  
    The client was an avionics service firm.  One of our tasks was bringing
    up the new inventory system for all the different departments.  My
    first meeting with the boys in used parts was very interesting.
    
    I was the first MIS person they'd ever seen, so it made me
    wonder about user input on the design.  They demoed their existing
    antique IBM system to me (whereupon I immediately saw the solution
    wasn't gonna fit, but that's another story), then showed me several
    real transactions.
    
    A gent calls up asking for a windshield for a 727.  They pull up the
    part number on the screen and it shows there's three.  One of the boys
    writes down the bin number, runs back to check, returns with the news
    that there's only 2.  At this point, they sell one and type in a 1 over
    the three.  No audits, nothing...on a $10k part.
    
    Well, this place had superb security (supposedly).  Cameras, guards,
    turnstiles, checking of all lunchboxes, etc.  I became interested 
    here, 'cause the used parts boys said the windshield "was probably
    called out by a mechanic but not used, and would find its way back to
    inventory eventually".  I asked how many times they'd ever had to up an
    amount...none, they said.
    
    This prompted me to take a stroll around the parking lot, where I
    looked under and in the trucks and cars.  I saw $1500/ea aircraft light
    switches for foglights, stainless steel brake lines/fittings, extruded
    aluminum dashes/grills/liners, interior lighting systems that were
    nothing short of phenomenal, etc.
    
    How the *hell* (they've got our number, ya know) did these guys get all
    this stuff out of there?  It was fascinating!  One guy, same company,
    actually got arrested trying to sell a *jet engine* to American
    Airlines!  That was stupid (aircraft parts require extensive certs), 
    I'll admit, but he got it out without anyone knowing!
    
    In other words, to catch those who are determined is going to take some
    work, and checking lunchboxes and thermos probably won't do it.
    
    								Tex

Could be very interesting to pull up to the line at Oshkosh with something that
looked suspiciously like a 747.  A whole new trend in homebuilt aircraft.
Fun!

al

I wonder if Ford Motor Co. assembly employees ever have to buy car parts 
for their Fords?

I've seen Art *and* his thermos, by the way.  I might be suspicious
of such a character.  ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-)

BTW, did you take the thermos "fishing" this weekend, Art?

| I wonder if Ford Motor Co. assembly employees ever have to buy car parts 
| for their Fords?

    who'd need spare parts for a new car when you have warranty :-) better to
    be Ford a employee in the stock room for parts to older models.

Nitpick accepted.  You're right, of course.
(I would think, however, that not all parts are completely redesigned.)

    .last few
    
    Reminds me of the "1949 50 51 52 ...  Caddy" sung bu (I believe) Johnny
    Cash.
    

  >>The guards at G Building of Raytheon in Waltham frequently asked to look
  >>inside my empty thermos bottle as I was leaving.

This reminds my of the story where a man dayly crossed the frontier 
with his bicycle and a bag full of sand.

The customs officers allways asked for the contents of the bag. The man 
explained that he's driving faster downwards with more weight at the 
back of his bicycle.

They allways sieved the sand, hoping to find anything and never found out
that he smuggled a new bicycle every day....


andre

I thought it was a wheelbarrow full of sand, and he was stealing wheelbarrows.

Fraudulently "scrapped" material is also a big scam. When I worked at Texas
Instruments in a facility with a machine shop, there was an incident where a
machinist was scrapping whole chunks of high-quality metal blanks, filling out
all the appropriate paperwork, then fishing them out of the recylce bin in back
(since they sold off metal shavings etc. just to get rid of them, not really for
recovery of the money) and selling them to scrap dealers. Potentially someone in
a board manufacturing area could do the same, just cut a little etch to kill the
board, then scrap it and salvage it once it has been disposed of, unless the
area reworked damaged boards. I also remember a case at TI where someone was
pocketing spools of the fine gold wire used to connect IC's to their pins before
being encases in ceramic or plastic. Such small, high-value items are hard to
track. One chip manufacturing process used very high-grade platinum ingots that
would fit nicely in a large thermos; I believe their cost was in the tens of
thousands each (and they were rather heavy). They were just stacked in the
maintenance spares cabinet.

    I worked for a summer in college at a nuclear power plant, in the
    electrical shop. Most of the guys were oldtimers and this was sort of
    the plumb electrician job you would get if you had been with the
    utility for 30 years.  My supervisor was this crusty old guy, maybe two
    years from retirement. It was summertime and he enjoyed visiting and
    talking about his summer cottage. One day he brought in photos, and he
    half-joked about the electrical service on the cottage, the photo
    showing that his service entrance, conduit, etc was nuclear-grade
    stainless steel (big bucks).  Anyway, the shop supervisor walked by,
    and the guy pointed out the photo to him too. The shop just shook his
    head without saying anything and walked away.
    
    We had a good laugh anyway.
    JP

   In 1974, there was an incident where a guy was stealing components
   from working systems from the labs in the Mill.  It was amazing, like
   nobody would *notice* that the memory suddenly dropped from 24K to 8K
   (remember this was 20 years ago and machines even had core memories :-)

   He was arrested and fired, I don't know what happened after that,
   but assume he was a farmer for a while.

   Also, I know of incidents where the security personnel were responsible
   for thefts, as well as the so-called "salvage" people.

   - Jim

From:	SCHOOL::HELLEN "Karen Hellen - 226-6595 *High Performance Networks*  30-Nov-1994 1431" 30-NOV-1994 14:46:31.31
To:	@ALLHPN
CC:	
Subj:	Minimizing Personal Loss at Work

From:	DELNI::BICA "AND I THOUGHT THIS WOULD BE EASY  30-Nov-1994 1204" 30-NOV-1994 12:04:38.70
To:	@LKG1SEC.DIS; @LKG2SEC.DIS;
CC:	BICA
Subj:	PLEASE FORWARD TO EVERYONE IN YOUR GROUPS

  +---------------------------+  TM
  |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |            
  | d | i | g | i | t | a | l |
  |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |
  +---------------------------+

       
            I N T E R O F F I C E   M E M O R A N D U M 
 
                                             Date:  30-NOV-1994
  To:  Site Distribution                     From:  Michael McLellan
                                             Dept:  LAPM Security Group
                                                    Cluster Security Manager
  cc:  Elton Allen                         Tel No:  226-7815
                                              Loc:  LKG1-2/K11


  Subj:  Minimizing Personal Loss(s) at Work


  Although some of us like to think of our offices and general work areas
  as extensions of our own home, affording us the same protection and
  security, the potential for personal loss here at work mirrors that of
  any large open environment.

  For that reason, it is essential that all employees observe and practice
  some very basic preventative measures that will significantly diminish 
  your chances of being victimized. 
  
   * Do not leave purses, wallets, checkbooks, cash, credit cards, and other
     valuables items unattended in your office.
     If you need to step away from your area, even for a moment, take those
     items with you or lock them up. 
       
   * Try not to leave larger sums of cash in your area for extended periods
     of time, i.e. work group collections, coffee funds, etc.

   * If you must keep small amounts of cash in your area, vary it's location
     and only access those funds privately.  

   * Do not unnecessarily leave loose bills and/or change in your draw(s).
     If you do, get in the habit of consistently locking those draws before
     you leave your area.

  These steps may seem unnecessary to some but the potential for internal
  theft is a real concern, especially with the holiday season quickly
  approaching. 
 
  If you have any questions, comments, or concerns, please feel free to
  contact me directly. 
   

    

I entered this a couple of months ago, pulled it for some spelling correction,
and forgot about it.


         <<< HUMANE::DISK$CONFERENCES:[NOTES$LIBRARY]DIGITAL.NOTE;1 >>>
                        -< The Digital way of working >-
================================================================================
Note 3429.22                     Employee Theft                         22 of 22
SCHOOL::NEWTON "Thomas Newton"                       88 lines   7-OCT-1994 12:53
               -< Digital's had it bad; society's had it worse. >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
When I was working in MRO1, we had a 19" color workstation monitor disappear
without a trace.  Practitioners in my group legitimately borrowed the machine
from an office and put it in a common room which was usually, but not always,
locked.  While it was in the common room, someone swiped the monitor.  I was
not impressed with Security's reaction to our theft report, but that may have
been partly our group's fault, as we did not initially know the serial number.

Recently, in LKG1, some person or persons unknown stole a lot of memory from
a computer lab on the third floor.  The second and third floor labs had been
open during the day and keycard-locked at night - but now are keycard-locked
all the time.

Crackers (i.e., car thieves on the information superhighway, as opposed to the
innocuous MIT-type hackers) stole a very valuable piece of source code from us
over our network.  My information on this comes from an external publication -
so please don't try to tell me that this is secret information.  At the time,
we apparently could not be bothered to take simple measures to stop the theft.
Fortunately, these criminals did not make much use of the stolen source code.
Since then, I believe we have gone to the other extreme, and created a sort of
fortress mentality when it comes to network connections.  (And we appear to be
actively reducing the risk of software theft, by getting out of large parts of
the software business.  Thieves can only steal software that exists.)

Former DCU president and convicted fugitive from justice Mangone defrauded the
Digital Credit Union and Barnstable Credit Union of something like $18 million.
People attempting to run for the DCU Board of Directors on reform tickets have
generally won election in the end, but only after encountering DCU and Digital
behavior which has raised great questions in many people's minds.  (There is a
DCU Notesfile and an alt.digital.dcu newsgroup where you can find out more and
discuss this more; please don't start a rathole in this Notesfile.)

There were two swindling stories that made the paper:

    1. I remember a report of a criminal felony trial in which a defendant
       had extreme trouble convincing a jury that parking a car many blocks
       away from a Digital warehouse at midnight, going around to the back
       of the warehouse, and removing many valuable circuit boards without
       written authorization was legitimate business behavior.  :-)   This
       defense is so amazingly duplicitious and inept that the story is an
       obvious candidate for the GOLDEN_TURKEY notesfile.  As I recall, the
       jury did not buy the story, and convicted him of the felony.

    2. I remember a report of a scam in which a third party which had some
       legitimate contract to (dispose of?  salvage?) broken Digital parts
       was turning around and selling those parts to our customers in some
       way that sounded like misrepresentation, fraud against the customer,
       and breach of contract with Digital all rolled into one nice package.
       I believe the people involved in this scam were also convicted, and
       that this story received front-page coverage in one of our internal
       wide-distribution newspapers or newsletters (Digital This Week?).

The savings and loan fraud is a scam against all of us.  You, me, and Digital
will be paying taxes for 30 years while most of the bastards who masterminded
those frauds get away scot-free.

During the time that I've been working for Digital, these are the only thefts
related to work that I've heard about.  All of these are terrible and reflect
poorly on society.  However, during this time period, a criminal or criminals
unknown broke into my apartment.  Police think the guy was a career criminal,
looking for money to feed his drug habit (I think this is non-specific enough
and far enough removed in time not to hurt their detectives' chances).  Another
tenant who was living there at the time later told me that almost all of the
apartments there had been burglarized within a time period of my experience.
I suppose it could have been different groups of criminals, but after what the
police told me, my personal opinion was that it was the same person or persons,
and that he, she, or they were really on a roll.  :-(

Considering that Digital has tens of thousands of times more employees than my
household has people, Digital may actually have gotten off rather lightly!  Of
course, there may be many other thefts of which I am unaware.

Microprocessor chips, laptop computers, lab tools, and tapes full of computer
data are so small and so valuable that there is no practical way to absolutely
prevent their theft.  I, for one, would not work for a company that forced me
to submit to a body search or personal belongings search, and short of a very
intrusive, anti-American security policy, you are not going to get rid of all
the opportunities people have to smuggle valuables out the door.  I believe
that our current Internet firewalls against TELNET use are counterproductive.
They make Mosaic unreliable; they prevent our use of any public Internet
service offered in the TELNET fashion; and there are other ways that thieves
can attack us if they are determined to do us harm.

Even if you imposed military-style security, thieves who have a great deal to
gain (such as the Intel 486 armed robbers) can always attempt to find bribable
people in the security force - and again, it only takes one or two.  Treating
employees in general as people who want to be honest, and as professionals who
should be trusted and respected is the best policy.  Not only is it ethically
right, but it puts employees on your side, giving you a big pool of watchdogs.

    In some jurisdictions theft must include "the intent to permanently
    deprive the owner of property".  Therefore copying software is not
    theft, legally, since the owner doesn't lose the property.
    
    What's happening to close the legal loophole is the passing of IT
    related laws.