Conference 7.286::digital

      We've had the same here in the UK. Starting to run low on some
    things; I've written my name on the back of my Post-it pad, helps me
    find it again when it 'walks'. Can't help feeling that the savings are
    small, relative to the amounts of money wasted elsewhere. Not saying we
    should be profligate with our paperwork, but do such measures really
    justify the inconvenience caused by this sort of cheese-paring? Rather
    like trying to bale out the Titanic with a teacup.
    
    Ken                                        

    re: .0 any tips ...
    
    How about use those re-used paper as toilet paper.
    And trade-in toilet roll for some new paper. :)
    
    sorry, couldn't resist.
    
                                        

    Don't worry, it's a standard total-panic measure used by many
    organisations, when middle management needs to be seen to be doing
    something.
    
    The rationale behind a stationary purchase freeze is that there are
    people in the company who are DELIBERATELY wasting paper in a
    determined effort to bring the company to its knees.  These subversive
    Bolsheviks are totally paralysed by such a far-sighted response to
    their dastardly actions, and immediately commit Hari-Kiri.
    
    Martin (writing this on an old copy of Digital Today)

    you still have some postits?
    
    sigh,
    
    ed

    I recommend saving all your post-its in a pile on your desk so that 
    they can be reused. The best ones are the ones you find on your 
    terminal that just say "Please ring .........". 
    
    Of couse the system falls down if somebody is daft enough to write a
    date and time on them but I've never yet found anybody that stupid
    here.
    
    To save even more money buy a glass topped desk so that you can use the
    backside of a post-it and stick it to the underside of your work
    surface. 
    
    yours economically,
    
    Andy ;-)
    
    p.s. Remember the End of the Fiscal is a great time for collecting
    reports and documents. These will make a great source of energy in
    November when the air-conditioning starts working !
    

    Anybody know when (or if) COSMOS will be available again?  We're all 
    out of pens, staples, tape, manila folders, etc.
    
    (For those of you who may not be familiar with COSMOS, it is the 
    automated ordering system used in the US for office supplies, copier
    supplies, etc.)

The U.S. field has been suffering from these kinds of problems for years.

In our case, we've had to shut down one of our printers, not because of a
lack of paper, but because of a lack of toner.  Rumour has it that we may
have gotten approval to purchase some more toner, but I'll believe it when
I see it.

It's another case of penny-wise, pound-foolish.  It's hard to review design
documents, have code reviews, etc. when the team members can't read the item
to be reviewed and it's not available for the review.

Bob

    Well, for the past few months, I have been getting my stationary from the 
    offices of people who have left the company.  I gotten some real good
    stuff too :-)

    -Bruce

    As I sit in the "New WORKING Environment", in the basement of my house,
    I sympathize with the previous discussed issues regarding a lack of
    necessary items like paper or toner for the laser printers.
    
    I would propose a couple of options:
    
    1.)  Let's Barter, I know we have stacks of paper in our office,
    however our printers are starving for toner.  It's like the days of the
    gas shortages.  Expensive machines left idle due to a lack of fuel.
    
    I offer 5, count 'em, 5 packages of bleached XEROX branded, 250 sheets
    per package, white cutsheet paper.  Suitable for your LN03 or LPS20.
    
    In return I ask for a toner cartridge and maintenance kit for an LN03+.
    
    2.)  Regress your technology.  Go ahead, plug in the old reliable
    LQP02,  the LA75, or yes, even the workhorse from hell the LA120.
    
    They work, forever.   There are abandoned printers and supplies
    everywhere.  They do print text pretty darn well.  It's like riding a 
    bicycle to work instead of driving your car.  Maybe you could start 
    a cult of "CAVE dweller DECCIES" that only used old technology like the
    LA12, the VT52, or for the eclectic, the Robin.
    
    Regards,
    
    MAD MARK (20ma Current Loop Forever!)
    
    
    
    

re.8:

>It's hard to review design documents, have code reviews, etc. when the team
>members can't read the item to be reviewed and it's not available for the
>review.

I haven't had recent experience of these but ten years ago we used to do these
on-line using software tools such as email and notes, and for group meetings we
used projectors, so everyone could see.

Dave ;-)

    Maybe the paperless office IS coming faster than the paperless bathroom
    8^)
    
    Mark
    

    3262.0
    If you are short of paper try utilizing Digital stock certificates.
    There is ample supply and the price is well below the cost of new
    printer paper.
    No worries mate!

    Quick fix!
    
    	Use pencils when writing on paper or post-it's.  Use a soft lead so
    that it's easy to erase the writing when the memo is no longer valid.
    Hard lead pencils tend to indent the paper, and make it difficult to
    glue post-it's to newsprint in order to feed it through the print rollers.
	I found another good source, is to call up all your supply houses,
    mail order clearance centers etc, and have them send you all the latest
    updates.  Some of it comes printed on one side only.
    	I have heard that you can use Hydrogen Peroxide to bleach out print
    on old VMS documentation.  Version 4 or 5.0 manuals should keep you
    going for a few days.
    
    
    Regards
    Rod (I'd like to catch the miserable.. petty post-it pillferer that 
    	 ran off with my just completed proposal.)

Pessimist Reaction:   "No no, Mr. Customer, the proposal is printed on the TOP 
of each page... ignore the stuff printed upside down on the back.  We can't 
afford the paper."

Optimist Reaction:  "Here's the proposal you requested Mr. Customer," handing 
over a 3 1/2" floppy, "Its in MS-Word, in color, with financials in a MS-Excel
speadsheet, linked into the document, along with the artwork for the products 
being proposed."

Bob

    I am so glad I kept the old LA75 and the LA100.  I always said you
    never know when you might need them again.  I also have a DECmate II
    sitting right beside my PC.  I'll never get rid of the old dinosaur. 
    It's the only thing that works!!  
    
    
    
    
    
                                      

    If you need stuff, put a reply in the current swap notesfile. 
    Surprising how much stuff people are storing/finding these days.
    
    WKOL10::DELTA_SWAPSHOP
    
    -s
    

Why not trade in the toilet rolls ( you know, the soft and comfortable 
type presently in use ) for the old fashioned but highly economical 
waxed, shiny, hard loo paper AND get a box of printer paper as well
out of the money saved.

As I used to say ... " the paper is so antiseptic you could bleed 
to death from it "

To paraphrase somewhat...

 You could bleed while the printer rolls :-) 

    Comical reply:
    
    Put it on a floppy and take it to your customer site (who no doubt has
    better equipment) and print it on their machines.  You may have to
    listen to the "...your equipment is too expensive.." crap, but hell,
    you have your printout.

re.17:

...and if you're in the UK:-

VANGA::UK_SWAPSHOP

Dave.

Come on, I thought you guys in OZ knew better than that.
You have to use *fresh* toilet paper in the LN0's.
Good grief!

    re .14
    You have PENCILS?
    
    

    
    Well, at least we had EXPENSIVE paper while it lasted (XEROX).
    
    Ideas were submitted for "cheaper paper", but no action taken.
    I guess "no paper" is cheaper paper.
    
    

Re: basenoter

You're complaining because you haven't any printer paper?

Don't you realize there are people in Eastern Europe and Bangladesh
who don't even have printers????

-Jack

    We've got a limited amount pens and post its (of the cheapest variety) 
    but they are all "hoarded" items from bygone days.  I generally just
    buy my own and guard them carefully.  I think that's what they want 
    you to do about printer paper, too.  It's a double expense cut -- 
    they don't supply paper/pens/file folders, etc., so you take a 
    virtual pay cut by supplying your own! :)!!
    
    M.
    

    
    We've been out of envelopes (larger than the letter size) for a month. 
    We keep typing new labels and sticking them on top of the old labels!
    
    Same deal for the postage.  Print it out on the tape and stick that
    tape over the last postage used.
    
    Real impressive to customers.  I've gone out and bought a ton of
    supplies out of my pocket and keep them under lock and key...
    

ITOD - (In The Old Days) fanfold paper was usable 4 times, that's why
it was so wide!

I also remember taking a mag tape to the NSA so we could print out
our final listings (I was a DEC customer then...) getting the listings
out past the armed guards was easier than getting the mag tape back
out...

	Joe

    re .15
    
    	I'm sorry, I didn't realize that you were strictly a VMS shop,
    with no PC's.  I'll see if I can convert my proposal from DOS based
    applications to DecWrite, however you will have to re-compile the 
    data yourself.
    
    
    Rod (maybe we can use time limited toner, which will bio-degrade
    	 into a gaseous state which will totally disappear after 3 days,
    	 as long as the paper remains in good shape, it should be able
    	 to be re-used forever)

RE: all previous

Former VP Jack Smith would be proud that some managers are
still implementing his directives.  Save those paper clips!

I like the vanishing toner idea.  That has promise.  I better
sell my stock in paper and timber companies.  Somebody might
invent it.

    I buy all of my own supplies - post-its, pens, printer paper, postage
    stamps, fax paper etc. What's the fuss?
    
    Keith		
               

    
    When they print the annual report you'll only need one more sheet of
    paper	
    	|
    	|
    	|
    	|
    	|
    	|
    	|
    	|
    	|
        |
    	|
    	|
    	|
    	|
    	V
    to print your CV    <8:))
    
    	Shall we chip in for the toner
                                      

    Come on, you guys can be funnier than this.
    
    	How 'bout printing laser copies over old PCBYDEC catalogs. Tell the
    customer/prospect it is multimedia, and only Digital can do this.
    
    	Put all proposals on 3.5" Floppy disks, no label. If the customer
    actually gets the document off the disk, have 'em run 10 copies.
    
    	Now let's get real creative here...
    
    		the Greyhawk

Minor nit, 3.5" Disks count as stationery around here.

And, ever watched a customer receive a proposal on 3.5" floppy ONLY, it
really annoys the hell out of them! They like the idea, but not without
at least one paper copy they can refer to straight away. They have as much
trouble printing on our printers as we do.

And please be frugal with paper clips, you never know when an engineer
will need to fix an alpha with one.

- John

    G'day All,                           
    
    >-< AREN'T WE A PAPERLESS COMPANY {:-) >-
    
    The real rational behind all of this was to force us all into making
    this company a paperless and environmentally friendly, it has nothing
    to do with our difficulties.
    
    I know this because I am not a pin head but a know it all !!!
    
    Yours Smuggle,
    
    Sunil
    
    PS - Call me Mr. Smug if you like :-)

    	Actually it's about time we became paperless.  I envision a future
    where no paper is used at all instead...
    
    ...we develop a process which allows us to produce paperless paper. 
    Using PVC or someother plastic medium, we can produce a product that
    will have the same charachteristics as paper, with the exception, that
    you can just Nuke' the old stuff into a blob for reprocessing into
    plastic post-its, krinkly newsprint or somesuch.  I think I'll go buy
    some shares in Exxon.
    
    
    Rod (Polyethelyne, Polyester, Polybutrate and Poly Plaster....the world
    	 of make believe)

  The problem with fanfold paper, which is what the base noter is talking 
about, is that you can't just go to your local stationery store and buy it.
I assume this is the case in Australia too. And even if you could, you would
still have to haul that heavy box around. 
  Is there a DELTA_SWAPSHOP notesfile for Australia? If not, maybe you can 
start one.
  Years ago my group ran out of printer paper, not because of budget constraints
but just because someone didn't plan ahead. NOT fun.

Regarding "using your own paper"..

	how? Every time I want to print something, should
	I 
		diable to Q
		load my paper
		enable the Q to accept jobs from me only
		print my file(s)
		diable the Q
		remove any paper I had left
		reanable the Q for all users


		??????

 	- CT

Re -.1 

	I don' know of  any "swap" notes conf in Australia,
	but I often get mail with 300 names in the duistribution
	list saying some one wants to Assett-Transfer/Purchase 
	something.... last week some wanted to transfer a VT100 !!

	Note: The 300 or so is EVERYONE in DEC Australia, New Zealand,
	      & often some smaller island contries nearby. It's one
	      of those ALL-IN-1 lists (PS: I've never seen or used 
	      A.I.1 !)

    re -1
    
    >& often some smaller island countries nearby.
    
    Fiji. :)
    

   Re: Note 3262.36 by TOOK::MORRISON "Bob M. LKG1-3/A11 226-7570"
   

�  The problem with fanfold paper, which is what the base noter is talking 
�about, is that you can't just go to your local stationery store and buy it.
�I assume this is the case in Australia too. And even if you could, you would
�still have to haul that heavy box around. 

   Where do you live? I live on the edge of the suburbs of Dayton, Ohio. 
   .5 mile to the west are cattle and horses.  Not exactly a bustling
   metropolis.
   
   Within a 3 mile radius of my house (that I can count from memory) are
   5 stores that carry fanfold paper.  At 5 miles it goes to over 20. 
   At 15 miles; close to 50.  
   
   These are Babbages, Office Depot, Meijer's, WalMart, Sam's, several
   local office supply stores, scads of Mom&Pop computer stores,...  All
   of these carry the 500 and 1000 sheet boxes.  Office Depot, Sam's and
   the office supply places carry these as well as the 3500 sheet boxes. 
   Office Depot (a great place to shop) has about 50 ft. of aisle (both
   sides) devoted to paper.  They have narrow and wide fanfold, 1-part,
   2-part, & 4-part fanfold.  Carbon and carbonless fanfold. 
   White-white and lined fanfold.  
   
   When I need paper, I ask myself what else do I want to go shopping
   for, and decide which paper store to go to based on that.

I never knew that LPS20's, which I believe the basenoter mentioned, accepted
fanfold paper?

-Jack

In order to facilitate use of personally-supplied paper, each employee
will be issued a personal LPS20. This will save the company millions
of dollars in paper costs, and will allow each employee to manage his 
paper supply as he sees fit.

In a related issue, corporate telecom is asking that all network messages
be sent using only recyclable data bits. We are losing a great deal of 
money due to the use of non-recyclable bits as messages go into the bit 
bucket. Please remember that bit buckets are not a recyclable resource, 
and the current supply is being used up faster than forecasted.

Have a nice day!

    ...I'd like to know where all the old phone mail messages go.  There's 
    some valuable stuff there, I'd hate to imagine that it's just discarded
    will-nilly when recycling today has become a valid option.
    
    Regards
    Rod (I recylce my headers)

    I don't know about you folks, but my phone messages seem to recycle
    themselves.  Same message, different day, different customer, etc. 
    It's a nifty little feature of our voice mail system, I guess ! :)
    
    M.