Conference 7.286::digital

	Re:  "And what was the reason for creating this at the Mill?"

	Probably cost saving.  Who's willing to pay a VP $100 an hour
	to roll around Maynard looking for a parking space?

	Regards, Robert.

    The orginal reason was to provide a obvious stake in the ground to
    prevent an explosion of "perquisites" throughout the company.
    
    The problem of perquistes is that it undermines the egalitarian nature
    of any company, especially Digital which demands more from its
    employees than most.  Offsetting the benefit of one parking space is
    the morale problem that it creates for the rest of us.
    
    From parking spaces it goes to all kinds of special and expensive
    treatment, and then to an _obsession_ on the part of managers with
    accumulating more and more perks.  More time and money wasted.  Even
    the appearance of perks is corrupting.
    
    To the previous reply: Who's willing to pay _any_ employee _any_ amount
    of money to roll around Maynard looking for a parking space?
    
    All the better that VP's are exposed to the irritations that the rest
    of us have.
                                                                

    Digital Equipment (Singapore) is willing to pay employees (people on
    carplan) $$ to park 10 minutes walk away.
    
    We have recently moved into this building who didn't provide enough
    season parking lots (US$60 a month), so instead of allowing people to
    park hourly (comes to perhaps US$150 monthly), they have to park at
    another building 10 minutes walk away (cost US$75). The scheme of
    selection to the season lots is "years of service with DEC", regardless
    of job. So now we have maybe 70-100 people spending 10 minutes to get
    to their car everytime they go to see a customer, and this is Sales and
    Support people we're talking about!
    
    

    For most of us who work in offices, I would think a good long
    walk from car to office would be regarded as a beneficial,
    much needed form of exercise.  
    
    But the original note is a little disheartening.  Long ago
    when I worked in the Mill and when Digital was a much smaller
    company, I remember one day seeing Ken Olsen's secretary putting
    money in a parking meter on Main Street.  I asked if it was Ken's
    car and she said yes it was - He was like every one else and had
    no special parking privileges.    It's sad to see that some
    these basic values of fairness and democracy are slipping away.
    
    d
    

    I have no problem with reserved parking spaces for biggies.  Most
    of the much-loved egalitarian nature of Digital is a myth anyway.

re 1253.4 by CURIE::DIMAN 

>    For most of us who work in offices, I would think a good long
>    walk from car to office would be regarded as a beneficial,
>    much needed form of exercise.  

Well said!

    The concept is called the "slippery slope".
    
    If reserved car spots are OK, then what isn't OK?  What is the standard
    for what is a proper perk and what is an outrageous one?
    
    Maybe the egalitarian nature of Digital is a myth, but it's one that's
    common enough, so that any system of perks triggers the "Can this be
    Digital?" reaction.

The theory is that the vp's are always driving in and out of Maynard
-- since most of them have their primary office in some other "Greater
Maynard Area" plant.  (Why this applies to their secretaries is another
matter).

The vp area is in building 12 (where *all* of 8/11 software engineering,
software support, labs, and Ken and Gordon's offices were when I started
in 1972).  From there, it's a good 1/4 mile walk to the most convenient
-- non-empty -- parking lot (Lower Thompson).  The lot behind building 23
seems to fill fairly early in the morning.

At the time this policy was instituted, All of the mill parking lots
were full to the brim with busy workers.  Now, Lower Thompson never
fills beyond about 80%.  There are still a dozen or more spaces between
buildings 3 and 1 that are un-reserved; but you have to arrive before
7 am to get one.

Martin.

A corporation is a (hopefully enlightened) dictatorship, not a democracy.
Perks for VP's, even in Digital is nothing new.  You can be sure that 
Digital's executives have benefits that match those in most other 
companies.  For example, you can be pretty certain that VP's in Digital
do not have the same health plan as the rest of us do.  Most large companies
have executive health plans that pay for EVERYTHING (e.g. Glasses, 
no deductable, and private rooms.)  There is has to be a bonus plan as well.

In other companies I have worked for the existance of these plans was
a closely guarded secret.  What was even more secret was who was getting
the benefits from these plans.

    There are three big parking lots around the Mill, I don't see the need
    to park INSIDE the mill... I worked for many years there and always
    parked at the upper Thompson street and WALKED up the hill to the
    building... that was a welcome short walk to and from building to car! 
    I do know of course, that if you get there EARLY you can park a lot
    closer to the buildings but I was never tempted to loose couple hours
    of sleep just to save a few yards of walking... I found it very
    inviting to chat with whoever came near me while approaching the
    buildings, (I made a few good friends that way).

    Better verify the "sticker on the window" policy. I got one for my car
    simply by calling security and asking for one. Maybe they've changed
    the rules -- I've moved to Parker Street and haven't driven past the
    guard box for a while.
    
    Anyway, I've still got the sticker on my car. The policy used to be
    that you needed the sticker to get past the guard.  If you had one then
    you didn't even need to stop and talk -- just slow down so he could see
    the sticker and raise the gate. I always thought that all the sticker
    meant was that your car was registered with security. 
    
    There's only about 10 or 15 spots inside there which anyone can park
    in, anyway. The rest were "Blue Pass" spots. You had to get a blue pass
    from the guard to occupy one. My understanding was that they gave the
    Blue Passes to visitors -- not to Vice Presidents.

	re .1:

>>>	Probably cost saving.  Who's willing to pay a VP $100 an hour
>>>	to roll around Maynard looking for a parking space?

	Better a VP than a consulting engineer, a technical writer,
	an architect, a field service guy on the way to fix an
	important system that's gone down, a product manager...
	wait a moment, whom does that leave?

	Besides, as others have pointed out, if VPs don't feel the pain,
	the problem won't get fixed. If they don't want to feel the pain,
	they ought to go and work for a company that doesn't want to be
	efficient.

	"Further Up The Organization" has a section called "NO-NOs"
	(page 150).

	The first one is:

	"RESERVED PARKING SPACES. If you're so bloody important, you
	 better be the first one in the office. Besides, you'll meet
	 a nice class of people in the employees' parking lot."

	I think that just about wraps it up.

	/Tom

    Tom
    	once again I find myself totally agreeing with you - and thought it
    worthwhile to state publicly my thanks for continuing to propound such
    utter good sense here and elsewhere.
    
    
    /andy/

    re .12 Drat! someone beat me quoting Townshend! That sums it
    up exactly.

    re .23

    Tom, my hero :-)

>	"Further Up The Organization" has a section called "NO-NOs"
>	(page 150).
>
>	The first one is:
>
>	"RESERVED PARKING SPACES. If you're so bloody important, you
>	 better be the first one in the office. Besides, you'll meet
>	 a nice class of people in the employees' parking lot."

    Let's not forget the corollary:

    	"RESERVED PARKING SPACES. If you're so bloody important that you
    	should be the first one in the office, you don't need a reserved
    	parking space because the lot will be empty when you get there."

    Please, no comments about valuing the contributions of flex time workers.
    This is for rhetorical purposes only!


    /Peters

    
�	Better a VP than a consulting engineer, a technical writer,
�	an architect, a field service guy on the way to fix an
�	important system that's gone down, a product manager...
    
    Exactly, I'm talking about hoardes of sales people walking 10minutes
    EACH trip! For those not familiar with the field, it is typical for a
    sales person to pop into and out of the office 4 times a day. 
    
    Disclaimer: I'm not in sales, just sales support. And yes, I qualify
    for a season parking lot. So why am I raising this? Trying to do the
    right thing? I think I need to see a psycho.

    After some further questioning, I called Mill Security Operations about
    parking.  The guard in the shack mislead my interpretation of his
    answer.  It appears that you can still get a sticker for your window to
    park inside the lot (first_come_first_served).  And then there are
    "Blue Pass" parking areas inside the lot, I believe the ones outside
    Bldg 22.  I asked where the "Blue Pass" areas were in the lot so I
    would make SURE I wouldn't park there, and was told that the guard in
    the guard-shack knows, and "keeps an eye on those areas".  I was also
    told that you need "Executive Approval" to get a "Blue Pass", but I was
    not told who has them, or who actually gets them.
    
    I'll be picking up my sticker this afternoon.
    
    T  

	... reason I can think to get to the office before NWH!  :>) :>) :>)

    RE. 18
    
    "Getting a good parking place is the ONLY reason I can think to
    get to the office before NWH!"
    
    What is NWH?

When I worked in the Mill in 1980, I had one of those stickers for my car
window.  They were for use by Security in the "three-deep" parking lot.  This
was called the "three-deep" lot because cars were parked in it three deep.
It therefore was possible to get parked in by other cars and be unable to
leave.  The badge number stickers were there so that if somebody was parked in,
Security could find out who belonged to the cars blocking the car wishing to
leave, could locate them, and get them to come down and move their cars.

--PSW

    In my pre-DEC life, I worked at a company that had a very defined
    hierarchy, which included reserved spaces for managers. By the way, the
    president of the company had a SPECIAL space, separately paved, right
    by the front door, in which he parked his Rolls Royce (no kidding).
    
    As a manager, I decided to park in the back 40, and I rotated my
    parking pass to my direct reports a week at a time. I never used it
    because I enjoyed the walk, and the return on investment of giving to
    my employees was far greater than the snobbery I could've gleened from
    the pass. 
    
    It seems the point is moot since a few replies back, it appeared that
    the original concern was misinterpreted.
    
    Randy

    In my pre-DEC life I worked for a company that had assigned parking for
    everyone---the parking spaces were numbered, and each employee got a
    numbered sticker.  After I had been with the company for several years
    I got a call from "upstairs" telling me that I rated a better parking
    place, due to my time.  I was offered a place in the parking lot near
    the front door.
    
    However, I worked in the basement, and the basement entrance was near
    one end of the "lower class" lots.  As it happened, my assigned space
    was at that end of the lot, so I had a shorter walk to my office from
    my old spot than I would have had from the front door.  Therefore, I
    turned down the offer of a parking space in the upper lot, and asked
    that it be offered to the next person down the list.
        John Sauter

   Why didn't you ask for a better office as well...
   
   q
   

    re: .24
    
    I didn't want one---my office was right across the hall from the door!
        John Sauter

Sort of a rathole...

My first residency at Dec was at a company with a very well-defined
hierarchy, which was reflected in mailstops.  The vice-president of
engineering was at mailstop 'E', the assistant was at 'EA', etc.
The group I consulted for was at, more or less, EFTC-25X.

Since I was there for about two months, Dec rented a vacant apartment
from, as it turned out, the daughter of the vice-president of finance.

Every week, I bundled up a bunch of letters, stuffed them into an
interoffice envelope, and carefully and clearly wrote the addresses:

	From:	EFTC-25X	
	To:	F

It was very pleasant to watch the expression on the mail clerk's face.

Martin.

	re .26:

	(Compounding the rathole) It's a good thing this wasn't
	at Digital. Your weekly bundles might never have got to
	F, since they contained personal material. (See topics 199,
	309, 712, 1142 etc in this conference).

	It wouldn't have made the slightest difference that F was
	a Vice President, because this is a company which believes
	in equality and fairness, and would never treat a VP different
	from any other employee.

	/Tom

    re: .27
    
    Tom,
    
    Have you got your tongue unstuck from your cheek yet?
    
    Dick.

    re .3:
    
    I, too, work in a field sales office.  We have 83 sales, sales support
    and clerical support people working in Downtown Los Angeles.  Along
    with our lease, we are allowed to rent 11 parking spaces in our
    building.  These 11 spaces go to the district managers (2), unit 
    managers (6), and whoever else the district manager designates.  
    Everyone else parks in a structure that is a 5-10 minute walk away.
    
    This walk, however, gains importance when one realizes that usually the
    employees in this building do it several times a day, frequently
    dragging literature and/or equipment with them (there is a shuttle bus, 
    but it does not run between 10:00 am and 2:00 pm, nor after 7:00 pm).  
    Furthermore, the parking structure (8 levels underground) has no 
    security personnel after 5:00 pm.  This raises several concerns that 
    are often down-played by the managers...because the managers do not 
    have to deal with them on a daily basis.  In addition, the parking
    structure is part of a theatre complex, and on matinee days it is
    almost impossible to get your car in or out in a reasonable amount 
    of time.
    
    I should mention that most of the 83 people in this office were
    transferred here when this office opened a year and a half ago...they 
    did not choose the stressful drive and lousy parking situation of 
    their own volition.
    
    I, too, believe that "...if you're so **** important, you should be the
    first one at the office."  That's one of the things that drew me to
    Digital...the fact that nobody was so important that they required a
    reserved parking space.  I guess I was wrong.
    
    -Lynn T.

    
    In my opinion only one reserved parking scenario is acceptable:
    disabled parking.
    
    /. Ian .\

    
    re .29
    
     Has anyone *tried* bringing the situation to the attention of
    management? Perhaps they are not aware of the discomfort.
    Forgive if I missed that point in your note.
    
    -Mike Z.

	re .29:

	This is all backwards. The managers ought to use the
	remote parking, for the following reasons:

	(1) They usually come to work, stay in the office all day,
	    and go home. In other words, they don't need quick
	    access to their cars most of the time.

	(2) They don't usually have to carry anything heavy or bulky.

	(3) They don't have customers waiting for them.

	(3) Their employees need the local spaces much more than they
	    do.

	A good manager sees to his employees first. When
	Alexander the Great led his army through the burning
	desert of Gedrosia, with men dying of thirst in droves,
	some soldiers found a few drops of water amd brought them
	to Alexander in a helmet. He was sick, and they decided he
	needed it more than they did. Alexander lifted the helmet
	and poured the water out onto the sand. The message was
	clear: "My men come first. If they can't have water, I won't
	have it either". That's why they would follow him anywhere
	and defeat anyone.

	Not many Alexanders in downtown Los Angeles, it seems.

	/Tom