Conference iosg::all-in-1_v30

 Let's go slowly here ...
 
 When you write an AMTS command procedure (MYMAIDES.COM in your case) and
 assign it to an ALL-IN-1 account, it does *not* run within that account
 when new mail arrives ... instead it runs within *your* account when you
 send mail to it.
 
 	User:	SMITH		MAIDES: ALL-IN-1
 	User:	BROWN		MAIDES: MYMAIDES
 
 When user SMITH sends mail to user BROWN, user SMITH's account runs the
 MYMAIDES.COM DCL command procedure inside user SMITH's ALL-IN-1
 subprocess.   User BROWN may not even be logged on to the system at the
 time user SMITH sends her some mail.
 
 Thus, if you want a "normal" ALL-IN-1 style mail delivery to occur within
 MYMAIDES.COM, you use the $ WRITE OAMAILBOX "OA CABINET PUT_PENDING ..."
 subprocess function call to *PUT* the mail message into the PENDING file
 so that user BROWN can pick it up sometime later at *her* convenience.
 
 {Note: To be accurate, CAB PUT_PENDING does more than just update BROWN's
 PENDING record ... it also moves the file to the Mail Shared Area, writes
 an SDAF record, updates the Usage Count and so on ...}
 
 If you try to do a CABINET GET_PENDING within MYMAIDES.COM, you won't get
 very far because remember you're running MYMAIDES.COM within *your*
 account.   You can't *GET* her mail from your account.   Your best bet is
 to just leave things alone and let her "pick up" her mail later when she
 logs in.   She'll have the "1 mew mail message" alert signal waiting for
 her.
 
 I hope I haven't misread your request.  Please let us know if there's more
 you'd like to discuss.
 
 Bob Hunt

    re: .0
    
    I don't want to confuse Bob's eloquent explanation of how the AMTS command
    procedure should work.   But just in case you missed the answers to your
    question:
    
    >MYMAIDES.COM is my mail destination, and that DCL-command file should
    >be able to "actually deliver the new message". I.e. put the incoming message
    >from PENDING.DAT into the "UNREAD"-folder and increase UNREAD_COUNT.
     
    The unread count is automatically updated when you (i.e. your AMTS
    procedure) PUT the record to the pending file.
    
    The messages are placed in the UNREAD folder automatically when the
    recipient does an RN or II.
    
    John

Thanks, that seems to do it.

But I wonder what happends if you send the MAIL from a diferent node, (i.e.
delivery will be done by batch at a later time)? Your briliant replies suggest
that it would work anyway, and then all should be solved?!

And I'd be very happy, and thankfull to the net. Great working in a large
company, huh? I just love all knowledgeable people out there, (i.e. you:-),
who helps out!
				/nik

    re: .3
    
    If you send a message to a different node then the ALL-IN-1 fetcher
    on the recipient's node will execute the AMTS command procedure at the
    time it delivers the message (when it would normally take it out of
    the MAILbus mailbox and place it in the pending file and notify the
    user).
    
    John

"Done by the fetcher" means it is exectued in the context of the POSTMASTER
account.

Scott

There is something elusive over this, that escapes me:
I try this PUT_PENDING-thing, but fail due to lack of understanding:

$! OA$LIB:MYMAIDES.COM
$!   Gets called when recipient's OA$PROFILE_MAIDES = "MYMAIDES"
$!
$ write oamailbox "oa cab put_pending , 'MAIL', oa$user"
$ @dclmailbox
$ !
$ ! my stuff...

The ref manual says CABINET PUT_PENDING [doc-sym], appl-sym, user-sym

What I don't understand, and can find in the manual, is these symobols I must
include in the call. How do I know them?

/doc-sym/   Defaults to current message. How should I know the entry in 
            PENDING.DAT? I use default since the sender should have the
	    sent message as OA$CURMES when sending. If the sender is on
	    the same node, it should work, right? But if not?

/appl-sym/  A quoted MAIL. Quotology in VAX says it's easiest using "'".

/user-sym/  oa$user should work if we're on the same node as the sender.
            but otherwise?

Anyway, this piece of code doesn't deliver the message! Which I thought
it should do. And I try sending to myself, and sending on the same node.


Would it be easier polling PENDING.DAT to find users with unread MAILs?
This would be less neat, but if I can't get MAIDES working...
			/n

First, OA$USER is wrong.  You don't want your (the sender's) name - you want the
recipient's name: you want to add a "Pending mail" record for that user.   When
they do II, RN, etc, the code looks in PENDING, and transfers any new mail to
their inbox "on the fly".

If you're sending off node, then the AMTS stuff� isn't run on the sending node,
it's run on the receiving node, by the fetcher.  To recap what I said in .5,
OA$USER will then be POSTMASTER.

Yes, the message is "current" when the fetcher calls the AMTS routine to
deliver incoming remote mail.  I assume the same is true of the sender to
deliver local mail.

�To be more specific: the .CMU is run when you type in a local addressee which
has an AMTS MAIDES.  This is run in the sending user's process, and is used
to validate the address.  If there is no .CMU, the address is assumed to be
valid (as it matches a profile record).  This has the slight disadvantage that
user SMITH could be validly addressed as SMITH_IS_AN_IDIOT, etc...   Note the
.CMU isn't run if the addressee is remote.  The .COM for the AMTS MAIDES is run
to deliver the mail: either in the sending user's process for first-class or
express local mail, in the sender's (POSTMASTER) process on the local node for
second class local mail, and in the fetcher's (POSTMASTER) process on the
receiving node for remote mail.

Scott

    The address you're trying to deliver to will be in the ALL-IN-1 symbol
    #mailaddr.
    
    So your put-pending line should like:
    
    $ write oamailbox "oa cab put_pending ,'mail',#mailaddr"
    
    This ought to work, though I haven't tryed it. 
    
    D.

  You guys were right about #mailaddr being the thing.
  I thought that since sender and sendee was both me, it wouldn't matter.

  It did, and now I do get the MAILs.

  But no beep, if I'm logged in on my account. Do I have to reset MAIDES
  during those moments when the user actually running ALL-IN-1 in order to 
  give him beeps? Or is there another trick in anyones sleve?
					/n

================================================================================
Note 3090.6       Where is the MAIL delivery routine? Callable?           6 of 9
PAJERO::RHOTON "John Rhoton @TNO - DTN 871.7947"      8 lines  10-FEB-1992 10:29
                               -< Notification? >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Re: .0, .5
    
    The only other thing you might want is user notification.  I believe
    there is/was an ASSETS package available to do that.  Otherwise you
    could write a small Install/Execute function to broadcast the message
    to the user.
    
    John

 Try this ...
 
$ woam    = "write oamailbox"
$ dclm    = "@dclmailbox:"
$ !
$ ! Process incoming ALL-IN-1 message normally ...
$ !
$ woam "oa cabinet put_pending ,"""MAIL""",#mailuser"
$ dclm
$ !
$ exit
 
 There is no *BEEP* with an AMTS.   You can either do without it or cook up
 one on your own using the information reference in Jon's most recent
 reply.
 
 Personally, I have no problem doing without the beep.  I've chosen to
 run that way normally in ALL-IN-1 for years now.   ALL-IN-1 updates the
 MAIL field on menus at the slightest twitch anyway so the beep is just
 noise to me.   My opinion ...
 
 Bob Hunt

    I am not sure of its current status but for your beep you may be
    interested in the following:
    
               <<< POMPEO::DUA1:[NOTES$LIBRARY]EOASSETS.NOTE;1 >>>
                          -< EUROPEAN OFFICE ASSETS >-
================================================================================
Note 229.0      NOTIFY R1.1 ALL-IN-1 2.3 COMPLIANT NOW AVAILABLE       2 replies
POMPEO::MAINTAINER "Gabriella Palmero"               71 lines  28-JUL-1989 14:52
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



                             NOTIFY, Release 1.1
                                Solution Tool



     DESCRIPTION

     The NOTIFY package makes it possible to send one line messages from
     an ALL-IN-1 program to a users terminal.  The NOTIFY package may
     also be used as a standalone notification package.  The
     functionality is similar to the DCL REPLY command, but does not
     require the user to have priveleges.



     FEATURES


      o  The Notify function notifies a user with a message.  The message
         text followed by a BELL will be displayed on each terminal on
         the system which is owned by the specified username.  The syntax
         is:

      o  NOTIFY usersymbol messagesymbol

      o  Usersymbol is the VMS username

      o  Messagesymbol is the text of the message

      o  It allows ALL-IN-1 applications to communicate simple messages
         to users on the same node.  It does not use cluster-wide
         notification and it must be linked into ALL-IN-1.

      o  NOTIFY is CM compatible 




     DOCUMENTATION

     The NOTIFY package includes the following documentation:

      o  INSTALL.DOC which explains the installation and usage of this
         solution tool.




     MINIMUM HARDWARE REQUIRED

     Any valid VAX/VMS system that supports ALL-IN-1 Version 2.3.



     PREREQUISITE SOFTWARE

     The NOTIFY package has been tested with and will run with the
     following software:

     o ALL-IN-1 Version 2.3

     o VAX/VMS Version 5.1
    

    
    
_________________________
Revision number: 0001

    Current status = complete solution within sight.

    Simplicity is the first virtue, as you may know; so I dislike using
    too much code in this small project. This goes for the BEEP too:

    My current favourite idea, is to turn off Advertising New Mail when the
    user is running ALL-IN-1. I mean, no point in sending to his watch what
    he has on his screen. Turning it on  again, when he leaves ALL-IN-1 is
    peanuts: modifing DEFAULT-FRM does the trick, (LO, EXIT and BYE-options).

    But which way is the easiest/best to turn it on with?
    I thought of OA$LIB:OAINI.COM but /DEFER stops that.
    I remember something like <user-dir.ALLIN1>OAINIT.SCP that runs every
    time you enter ALL-IN-1; but since that is user-space, it may turn sour.
    Is there a SYoainit.scp? (c.f. LOGIN.COM and SYLOGIN.COM)

    Also, a minor detail:
    My form does this upon turning on Advertising:
    WRITE CHANGE PROFIL %KEY= OA$USER, MAIDES= "MYMAIDES"
    
    This does the trick, but the symbol OA$PROFIL_MAIDES is harder to
    update. I tried looking in Named Data for the SWC-form, (where you can
    change MAIDES), but found no clue.

    Does it matter? Who uses that symbol?
    The manual says READ_ONLY, but is there workarounds?
		/n

ps.
   should I post the interesting parts of the code here, upon completion?
   or is the answers you have given me enough?

    I believe you could do it as you suggest but I would think it would be
    easier to implement (less chance of conflicts) if you just make the
    check in the AMTS command procedure.  Using the lexical functions
    F$Context, F$PID and F$GetJPI it should be fairly easy and fast to
    determine whether the user is logged in and running the ALL-IN-1 image.
    Then you can either send the beeb to the watch or the terminal.
    
    Is it worth considering this approach?
    
    John

    Also OA$PROFIL_MAIDES will be updated from the profile if you call the
    function OA$INI_GLOBALS.  If that is the route you want to go.
    
    John

    I feel like I am talking to myself but with reference to what I said in
    .14 you could also use the ALL-IN-1 Check_Account function to see if
    the user is logged in.
    
    John

John,

I thank you for your zeal! But still I prefer shutting off Advertising when
the users run ALL-IN-1, (performance, anomaly risc, et.c.).

But I haven't succeeded in finding a global oaini.scp.
Shouldn't OA$LIB:OAINI.SCP run before <user.ALLIN1>oaini.scp?

If not, is there another mechanism that runs during initialization that I
could use?
			/n

    Hi,
    
    OA$LIB:OAINI.SCP is the global OAINI, however, as you might have
    noticed, will be superceded if ALL-IN-1 finds a User OAINI.SCP. You 
    won't find it on the system untill you create it (OAINI SCP SHARE in 
    Customization Management, Live location OA$SITE_LIB_SHARE:).
    
    What about if users will create a OAINI_USER.SCP instead, and the
    OA$LIB:OAINI.SCP will call this Script? That means both will be
    executed.
    
    Ciao,
    
    	Simon

    Simon, thanks. I solved the oaini-thing by letting my .COM-file
    search for oauser:OAINI.SCP and inserting a call to my OAINI-file.
    And if they didn't have any OAINI.SCP, then I just created it.
    (Using DCL-functions F$SEARCH and SEARCH).

    Now my application actually works! But the worst still remains:
    documentation and installation procedures.

    Two years ago we used the GIP-procedure, but I don't have that installed
    on my current system. Also I have heard rumours about it becoming
    obsolete. So, what do I do to find a tool for packaging my customization?

			/n

    GIP is rendered obsolete by the package/restore/transfer functionality
    in CM+ (ALL-IN-1 V3.0). In fact GIP served as a prototype for this
    functionality...
    
    Tony

    New customer demands requires new functionality...

    I need to be able to read Number_of_New_Mails in batch.
    This should be reasonably easy, using CAB-functions I'd guess.
    I'd be very gratefull if anyone could show me how to do this!

    (I.e. 
     I want a call that would work like:
     GET PROFIL.MAIL_COUNT[user-symbol]   <-- no such a field in PROFIL
     
     This call would not execute in any message-delivering context.
N :-)

    Get a copy of the Mail Filter from ASSETS. This includes a number of
    scripts that do what you want.
    
    GET #PENDING_KEY = "MAIL " OA$USER
    GET CAB$PENDING.COUNT[#PENDING_KEY]
    
    will retrieve the number of new messages for a user.
    
    Tony

It works interactively, but not in a procedure:

    $ ALLIN1/ NOINIT/ USER=MANAGER
    Enter CMD: GET CAB$PENDING.COUNT["MAIL userid"]
    %OA-I-LASTLINE, 2

But in a PROC.COM, I get
    %OA-W-INVGET, Symbol "cab$pending.count["MAIL userid"] not found"

My code is:
$ open/write fp inp.dat
$ write fp "get cab$pending.count['MAIL "+user_symbol+"']"
$ close fp
$
$ defi/user sys$command dev:<direct>inp.dat
$ defi/user sys$output  dev:<direct>out.log
$ ALLIN1/NOINIT/USER=MANAGER
$
$ type  out.log

I have set all privileges in DCL, before $ @PROC.
Why is this so?		/n

    
    Try:
    
    $ ALLIN1/NoInit
    GET #PENDING_KEY = "MAIL " CLI$USER_SYMBOL
    GET CLI$MAIL_COUNT = CAB$PENDING.COUNT[#PENDING_KEY]
    EXIT
    $ Write Sys$Output "''Mail_Count'"
    $ Exit
    
    and submit it.
    
    Ciao,
    
    	Simon

    It might also help to execute 
    
    OA$INI_INITIALIZE
    and
    MAIL INITIALIZE functions 
    
    before attempting to use anything like CAB$xxxx data sets.
    
    Tony

    Thanks. Of course it works now.

    The customer has an annoying employee, who keeps sending mails
    every day to him, (5-10). He wants to auto-delete these.

    Is it ok to just not CAB PUT_PENDING when that user is sender?
    I.e. would anything (PENDING.DAT) fill upp, with unused entries?

    I have my MYMAIDES.COM which delivers MAILs by CAB PUT_PENDING.
    So I don't use the ordinary MAIL-delivery routine.
    It can check sender's user id before PUTing Pending.
/n

    Surely the solution to an annoying employee is a polite message saying
    "don't send any more mail to me unless it is strictly necessary" rather
    than having a manager worrying about automatic deletions?  
    
    Tony

    Yes, you'd think so. But this user is deliberately sending MAILs, even
    though he knows his boss doesn't want them!

    So, when politeness fails, you need stronger solutions.

    Was it ok? To just not PUT_PENDING?		/n

    Sounds like the salary non-continuation plan should come into effect
    here :-)
    
    It should be ok to just not PUT_PENDING but one thing I'd check is that
    the usage counts are handled ok. To check this just ensure that the
    actual file containing the body of the mail message is deleted after
    everyone who ius referencingh it has deleted it and emptied their
    wastebaskets.
    
    Why can't the manager just do a multiple delete? Or better still
    upgrade to V3.0 and let someone else to the multiple delete for him?
    
    Kevin

    I like your humor! But...
    No, this is a govervental outfit, (the Swedish PTT), so you just don't
    sack people. Also I do, not question, as DEC's humble programmer.

    The reason for him not wanting to just delete the messages, is that they
    keep reminding him of this annoyer, (is there such a construct?).
    Then again maybe the annoyee, (how about that one?), just don't want to
    be reminded about his failures?!
    
    I'll check the usage count.		/n

    
    	Continuing with the earlier topic...
    
    	I would like to turn the messages around and send them back to
    	the annoyer to annoy him...
    
    	Presumably, when you have fixed ALL-IN-1 not to deliver this hate
    	mail, the annoyer will move to a different node/account, or start
    	using VMS mail or something?
    
    	How about the Personal Assistant, you could set up rules for when
    	to delete the mail.
    
    	Maybe the annoyee could get an "ex-directory" mail address? :-)
    
    Regards,
    Paul

    Re: .34
>                      -< What is 'Personal Assistant'? >-

    Well, to quote from the SPD...


> PRODUCT NAME:  ALL-IN-1 Personal Assistant, Version 1.0   SPD 37.53.00
>
> ALL-IN-1 Personal Assistant enables users to track new ALL-IN-1 mes-
> sages and locate documents within their ALL-IN-1 file cabinet using
> a variety of selection criteria. Use ALL-IN-1 Personal Assistant if
> receiving large amounts of mail or maintaining large numbers of doc-
> uments.
>
> The ALL-IN-1 Personal Assistant is an add-on subsystem to the stan-
> dard ALL-IN-1 IOS product. ALL-IN-1 Personal Assistant extends ALL-IN-1
> with a set of additional text searching and filtering functions. Ad-
> ditional forms are provided to assist users in dealing with the new
> capabilities.

	You may wish to ask questions that are specific to 
	ALL-IN-1 Personal Assistant in the IOSG::APA_SUPPORT
	conference...

    	
    HTH,

    Jack

    This note is an awful muddle!
    
    Any chance of moving some of its replies to a new note?
    
    D (I'd do it myself, but I'm not a moderator).
    
    

    Hi Dave!
    
    	I thought this was what was meant by Multi-Threading?
    
    	I was following it okay.... Just a bit wierd! :-)
    
    	I'll move the notes.
    
    Regards,
    Paul

>       <<< Note 33.25 by SIOG::T_REDMOND "Thoughts of an Idle Mind" >>>
>   It might also help to execute 
>   OA$INI_INITIALIZE and MAIL INITIALIZE functions 
>   before attempting to use anything like CAB$xxxx data sets.

I want to let my batch-job send a MAIL to manager when anything goes wrong.
Sending VMS-mail is easy, but isn't ALL-IN-1-mail also a piece of cake?

Don't want to use oa$ini_initialize since MANAGER may be running and then
I'd get %OA-E-NOREENTER...
__________________
$ ALLIN1/NOINIT/USER=MANAGER
oa$flo_open oa$lib:oaform
mail initialize
mail create/open/nosend/noedit/fname=MYFIL.TXT
%OA-W-CAB_NEED_FOLDER, When creating a document, you must specify a folder...
-------------------

Doesn't work, does it? I'm sure there is an easy workaround, and would be 
gratefull for a hint!
				/n   (running V2.4)

    
> Don't want to use oa$ini_initialize since MANAGER may be running and then
> I'd get %OA-E-NOREENTER...
> __________________
> $ ALLIN1/NOINIT/USER=MANAGER
> oa$flo_open oa$lib:oaform
    
    How about:
    	$ ALLIN1/NOINIT/USER=MANAGER/REENTER
	OA$INI_INITIALIZE
    	oa$flo_open oa$lib:oaform
    	MAIL INITIALIZE
    	etc.
    
    HTH,
    Jack