Conference bulova::decw_jan-89_to_nov-90

Most of your questions will be solved by reading (or 

following ) a pretty good course "DECWindows 

troubleshooting" developed by David Bryson. Course no

is EY-9460. Contact perhaps UFHIS::FBOECKER. 

Unfortunately I don't know if there is already an 

updated version for DECW V2.0. which I need badly.


--Hans.

	VMS DECwindows User's Guide, section 8.4. Just a quick browse
	through BookReader found it...

	Mike

>>        I would like to again ask the question asked by the two attached
>>    notes, neither of which seems to have been answered in this
>>    conference.  The customer with which I am working has gotten VMS 5.2
>>    and is trying to muddle through, but is frustrated by the lack of
>>    documentation.  Note 431.5 gives the event sequence, but nowhere can
>>    I or they find this in the published documentation shipped with the
>>    systems, nor can we find any descriptions of and restrictions
>>    applicable to the DECW$LOGIN.COM procedure.
    
    
>                         -< Not hard to find >-
>	VMS DECwindows User's Guide, section 8.4. Just a quick browse
>	through BookReader found it...
>
>	Mike
    
    
    Sorry, Mike.  I think you are wrong.
    
    The documentation shipped with the product (hard copy, bookreader
    docs are extra) has one reference to DECW$LOGIN.COM which we can
    find.  This states (quoting from page 8-8 of the _VMS DECwindows
    User's Guide_, which has no section numbers and a limited index):
    
         	You can start one or more applications each time
         you start a session by creating a command file named
         DECW$LOGIN.COM that contains the command lines listed in
         the previous table.
         .
         .
         .
         Place this file in your top level directory (SYS$LOGIN).
         DECwindows will execute the commands contained in the file
         each time you start a session.
    
    Since the file is mentioned there, I know we can talk to customers
    about it.  They ask simple questions of me, expecting both answers
    and pointers to the documentation.  No place else in the
    documentation is there a discussion of how and when the file is
    used, how it is related to LOGIN.COM, or what cannot be put into it. 
    Noplace have I come across documentation on DECW$SYLOGIN.COM,
    either.
    
    In glaring contrast, the _Guide to Setting Up a VMS System_ contains
    in section 4.26 (for VMS 5.0) a helpful section describing LOGIN.COM
    and SYLOGIN.COM.  It explains the typical uses for these files and
    even gives examples.

RE: .1

It will be a while for the updated course for VMS DECwindows Troubleshooting.  I'm
am currently working on the ULTRIX DECwindows Support course, but as soon as I 
finish it, I'll be updating the VMS course.  It will probably focus on VMS 5.4 
with Display PostScript and XLNS libraries.

David

    Can some one give me a pointer to where this subject might be
    properly discussed.  The customer wants information, and wants a
    pointer to any documentation which might be available.  They have
    asked if it is appropriate to file a problem report regarding the
    lack of documentation.

    
    1. The reference to the decw$login.com in the User's Guide is the only
    place that it is documented (I believe) - Chapter 8, last page
    
    2. Yes it is appropriate for the customer to file a problem report on
    the lack of documentation.
    
    In V1 of DECwindows, decw$login.com served two purposes:
    
    	1. A way for users to start applications when they logged in
    through the session manager.
    
    	2. Replaced login.com for the session manager login.  The reason
    that this was sooooo important, was that errors in a login.com (or
    sylogin.com) caused the session manager process to exit.  This meant
    that the system would hang since the login box was not restarted.   As
    a matter of fact, it was not only errors, but any line of code that
    assumed that there was a terminal on the other end of this interactive
    process (like INQUIRE).   Since a DECwindows login seemed like a
    different beast, and we didn't think we could handle all the existing
    login.com files, we invented decw$login.com and decw$sylogin.com. 
    Those files are run only when the user logs in from the Start Session
    box.  They are not run for any other DECwindows applications.  (As a
    side note, I think I know how to handle the errors from the login.com
    and sylogin.com now, but I still need to support this file).
    
    When the Autostart feature was added to the Session Manager in V2, the
    need for a decw$login.com has been drastically reduced.   It is no
    longer clear what kinds of things make sense for a user to put in a
    decw$login.com file (at least things we would want to document). 
    
    
    In other words, this is a hackers file.  I think 99% of our users can
    live without it and don't need it.   In V1 and V2, we didn't have a
    good place in the DECwindows documentation to document the more
    "technical" features of our product.  I think we are going to remedy
    this in V3.  We may have a chapter on "advanced topics" or "system
    manager concerns".  I think this would be a good place to document the
    existence and limit of decw$login.com
    
    If you or the customer need more information, feel free to file a
    problem report through the QAR system.   I can promise a timely
    response to a QAR, but I don't read notes files on a regular basis.