| T.R | Title | User | Personal
Name | Date | Lines |
|---|
| 515.1 | can't tell you the nodename, sorry... | TLE::D_CARROLL | Hakuna Matata | Fri Nov 09 1990 10:16 | 10 |
| >Then what are your views? I do hope that members from the countries
>other than America will provide their points.
If you are looking for a distinctly international input on your
question, you might also want to try the EURO_WOMAN conference, which I
believe has a larger international readership than WOMANNOTES...
(Not to discourage you from discussing it here...)
D!
|
| 515.2 | | LYRIC::BOBBITT | the odd get even | Fri Nov 09 1990 10:21 | 7 |
| um... EURO_WOMAN's conference notice states it is temporarily archived
and unavailable.
So he's in the right place....
-Jody
|
| 515.3 | | HOO78C::VISSERS | Dutch Comfort | Fri Nov 09 1990 10:31 | 5 |
| EW is back in business actually, now accessible on CHEFS::EURO_WOMAN
(KP7 or Select). Expect some furniture to be moved around as the movers
are still working...
Ad
|
| 515.4 | | LYRIC::BOBBITT | the odd get even | Fri Nov 09 1990 10:42 | 4 |
| I sit corrected. I'm glad it's open again!
Perhaps you could cross-post your question there!
-Jody
|
| 515.5 | you heard it here first!! :-) | HOO78C::VISSERS | Dutch Comfort | Fri Nov 09 1990 10:46 | 5 |
| It's open, but it hasn't been announced at all the proper places yet.
That's why hardly anybody knows... in fact this is the first real
pointer ;-)
Ad
|
| 515.6 | Hong Kong seemed like a real poor example | CADSYS::HECTOR::RICHARDSON | | Fri Nov 09 1990 12:42 | 27 |
| I'm surprised that he mentions pay scales in Hong Kong. Maybe things
have changed, but when I was in Hong Kong 3 1/2 years ago, I remember
being real angry when I picked up the English-language newspaper and
idly started to read the help-wanted section. All the ads specified
the sex and age of the desired employees! All the ads for engineers
(which is what I am) specified men aged 25-35. All the ads for
secretaries specified women, usually under 25. I saw LOTS of positions
I would have qualified for (unless there was a hidden requirement that
the job candidate also speak Cantonese, which I don't) had I been a man,
but NONE that I would qualify for as I am. Humph!!!!!!! Maybe things
have changed since, with the nuber of professional people who have
established residence elsewhere; there is probably a big shortage in
some professions by now (most of the people I knew in Hong Kong now
live in Vancouver).
It's still true that in the US men make more than women holding the
same positions. The percentage difference varies by profession. I
think in engineering in general it is around 70%. Various theories
have been explored as to why this is so, having to do with women taking
time off to start a family, having less dedication due to more
outside-work responsibilities, having fewer years of experience, and so
on. I think most of them are excuses, more than explanations. Most of
the male engineers I know make more than I do, some a good deal more
than I do, yet I have been in the workforce for 17 years, and am a
principal engineer at DEC, where I've worked for the past 15 years.
/Charlotte
|
| 515.7 | total segregation = good looking statistics | TLE::D_CARROLL | Hakuna Matata | Fri Nov 09 1990 12:49 | 10 |
| >I remember being real angry when I picked up the English-language
>newspaper and idly started to read the help-wanted section. All the
>ads specified the sex and age of the desired employees!
Could it be that the reason men and women get payed equally for the
same jobs in Hong Kong is because men and women don't *have* the same
jobs? If *all* engineering jobs belong to men, it is very easy to say
"All people in engineering get paid the same, regardless of gender.".
D!
|
| 515.8 | m�me chose | REGENT::BROOMHEAD | Don't panic -- yet. | Fri Nov 09 1990 13:26 | 7 |
| "...[A]lthough within the last two decades [1860-1880] a vast number
of new employments have been opened to her, statistics prove that
in the great majority of these, she is not paid according to the
value of the work done, but according to sex."
_History_of_Woman_Suffrage_
Volume 1, page 28.
|
| 515.9 | Hong Kong has changed | HANDVA::MICKWIDLAM | Oh! no more engineering!!! | Sun Nov 11 1990 22:29 | 24 |
| I think you do not understand the situation in Hong Kong. The tradition
here always make people think that boys should be doctors, lawyers an
engineer, while girls should be nurses, secretaries and so on. This
make more boys in secondary schools(high schools) choose science
or mathematics subjects more than girls. This implies that there
are not many female engineers in Hong Kong. But these female engineers
do get equal pay as male engineers! Other posts like teachers, computer
programmers or system analysts, social workers, police(cops) and
many other jobs, women have the same pay as men. Many posts' salaries
are calculate by point. When you apply for a certain job, both men
and women will get the same point if they have the same qualification.
The reason that the employers specify the sex and the age for some
posts is based on the companies' environment.
In the 80s, people still have the attitude about women go to work
should also take their jobs at home as wives or mothers. But near
90s, this situation changed. Many girls do not know how to cook,
or saw clothes while boys like to learn these!! This is because
boys always think that we can still 'survive' without women if we
know more(just like me, though I do have a lovely girlfriend who
know cooking and sawing).
Mickwid @hgo
|
| 515.11 | women in Japan | RDVAX::COLLIER | Bruce Collier | Mon Nov 12 1990 15:36 | 9 |
|
Sexual stereotypes are changing only very slowly in Japan. There are
positions other than secretary and teacher open to women, but there is
a strong presumption that women will work only a few years after they
finish school, and then quit for marriage and family responsibilities.
So, there are lots of jobs, but they are entry level positions that do
not lead to "careers."
- Bruce
|