Conference vmszoo::rc

    
    	Electric fuel pumps and Gas are a no, no. Gas is nasty stuff
    if the conditions are right. Glow will burn but dificult to explode.
    I use a hand pump. I've had four electric pumps on glow in app.
    two of my seven years in the hobby. I've had one hand pump for the
    last five years. I'm disapointed however in that two weeks ago the
    pumpimg blatter sprand a leak. I mean if they can't build something
    that will last 10 years why build it in the first place.
    	Seriously, I have used a Dave Brown six shooted hand pump for
    the last five years. The blatter did go a couple of weekends ago
    but I just went to my local hobby store and bought another one.
    I think it cost me all of $ 2.50. They even gave me the tie wraps
    to secure the new blatter with. It's a KISS design. No wobble in
    the assembly so I figure that it will be good for another five
    years. In five years I must have put close to 80 gallons of fuel
    thru this pump. It cost me originally 16.00 so I guess I'm getting
    my money's worth.   Dave makes pumps for glow and gas. I don't
    know of a pump made that is compatable with both fuels.
    
    
    						Tom
    
    					

    I bought the electric pump from Tower Hobbies and it lasted thru
    1 or 2 fill ups.  I should have sent it back but I removed the back
    so I could mount it to my flight box.  Apparently the motor and the
    connecting arm from the thing-a-ma-jig that does all the pumping
    has got to be lined up perfectly otherwise it will stop working as
    mine did.  I have been using the syphoning method ever since, but I
    am getting tired of tasting glo-fuel.  I plan on buying a hand pump
    with my next order.
      
    Ken
    

    I used to use electric pumps, but they usually cost more and are
    not as reliable as the manual pumps. My hand pump is about 10 yrs
    old now.

    
    I purchased a Tower Hobbies electric pump and although it makes
    one hell of a racket, it pumps. The question is for how long, since
    I have only used it to pump about a quart so far. I too removed
    the back to facilitate mounting it to my Flight Line Tote.
    
    				Michael Gallant
    
    One other comment I would be willing to pay more for a good quality
    electric pump as Im just lazy I guess.
    

    I vote for the Dave Brown hand pumps.  I have long given up electric
    pumps, as more fuel went outside the tank than in it.  I had the
    Sonic Tronic electric.  The Dave Brown's beat fuel bulbs (which
    disintegrate leaving particles in the fuel), and don't use up battery
    power for that extra 200 flights you want to squeeze out of and
    afternoon...

                          -< Ruitensproeiers >-
                                    
    Have you considered the use of car windsreen washer motors as fuel
    pumps. Automotive stores often sell as add on extras for older cars.
    It consist of a plastic bottle with an integral motor.
    
    I was dubious at first,  thinking  that the fuel  would  melt  the 
    plastic or gum up the motor, but I haven't experienced any problems
    and I've beem operating it for three years. I wouldn't recomend
    using it with petrol though.
    
    Considering it only cost me a few pounds (�) it has proved extremely
    good value for money. 
    
    The nipple (smutty word!) from the pump is exactly the right size
    for fuel pipe. The fuel can be poored directly into the top and
    the cap snapped shut, which prevents spillage. Also as it designed
    to bolt to the car body, it screws (even smuttier word) to the inside
    of my flight box. 
    
    The only slight problem is that the pump does not empty the bottle
    completely, which is not a problem if you use it every weekend,
    but should be drained out at the end of the season otherwise the
    fuel evaporates and leaves a residue of castor oil in the bottom.
    The pump is not revesable, which means you have to resort to 
    blowing out the remaining fuel from the plane, but As I am such 
    a meany, I always fly to the last drop and end up landing dead stick.
    
    I fly an OS40 fourstroke in my Magnatille (W.W.1 read barron replica).
    With a 6oz tank this lasts for what feels like an eternity
    well 45 minutes actually.
    
    
    John.
    

    re: .8
    
    	I've heard that windsheild washer pumps can be dangerous.
    Windsheild washer fluid (what they are designed to pump) is extremely
    non-explosive. The pump may hold up for a while but depending on
    the type of internal seals the designers used, the fuel can degrade
    them over time (it's probably the nitro that does it).
    So... after a while there might be some fuel seepage into the motor.
    
    Personally, I like the starter cone adapters for hand pumps.
                 
    GES        --+--
             \__[O]__/

    
    re: -.1
    
    	Question: You say you use an adapter that fits on your starter
    		  to drive your hand pump?
    
    	Comment: If in fact you do that, are you aware that your stater
    		 motor draws extremely high current in order to get
    		 high torque and as a result should not be run for more
    		 than a couple of seconds at a time. If you run a starter
    		 motor continuously you run a large risk of permanent
    		 damage to its winding due to overheating.
    
    		 This is not meant to critisize just some friendly advice
    		 that could save a costly replacement.
    
    					Michael Gallant
    

    
    re: .4
    		Well my tower pump died when I tried to start using
    it this year, just like Ken's in, I think, .6. I'm going to give
    electric one more try. I search for a week through all sorts of
    catalogues and finally found something useful. In a chemical supply
    warehouse catalouge I found a 12volt pump that claims to be corrosion
    resistant. I called them to check on two points;
    
    	1) Is the pump reversable?
    		Yes, not just the motor.
    	2) Are the pump parts resistant to Nitromethane?
    		Unclear. They are very resistant to diesel fuel
    		and fairly resistant to gasoline. I will find out
    	3) price:  #36.00 plus shipping.
    
    		I ordered one and let's see what happens. After all
    its only money. Ive said before in .4 I was lazy.
    
    
    					Michael Gallant
    

    
    This note's been idle for a while.  I'm thinking about an electric
    pump and noticed this Royal 12v job in Tower Talk.  Anyone have
    any experience with it?  It seems to have a better impeller design
    (brass gears) than the Tower "junk pump" but who knows?  It needs
    12v which is sort of a pain for me but if it works good I am willing
    to do it.
    
    Bill
    

    Bill,
    
    Once upon a time I had a Royal electric fuel pump which operated,
    optionally, on pen-cell batteries or 12v from a power panel.  This
    was an unadulterated piece-of-junque!!  Hopefully the one you're
    considering is an improvement over this turkey.
    
    Personally, I've had excellent luck with the Sonic-tronics pump
    and unhesitatingly recommend it.    

      |
      | |      00	 Adios,      Al
    |_|_|      ( >o
      |    Z__(O_\_	(The Desert Rat)

    
    Tower has the Sonictronics on sale too.  I was guessing that it
    was similar to the Tower pump because they don't say anything good
    about the impeller while the Royal ad says it has brass impeller gears.
    If it's anything like the Tower pump I don't want anything to do
    with it, but if it has worked more than five times it's probably
    not the same as the Tower pump!!!
    
    They advertise the Super X and Mark X.  The Super X comes in 3.6-6v
    or 12v version, both with control switch, the Mark X just 12v (and
    no control switch).  I'd rather get the 3.6-6v version.  Which
    one do you have, how long has it been working, etc?  Thanks -
    
    Bill

    Bill,
    
    Boy, you asked a toughie...without being able to look, I'm not sure
    just what marks my pumps are; I have two of em'.  Both are similar
    in that they have the fill/off/drain switch and both operate on
    12vdc from my power panel.  The older one is creeping up on 10-years
    old and has finally developed an intermittent leak but it still
    works fine.  The newer one is about three years old and still performs
    as new.  The newer one is slightly smaller than the old one but
    is identical in function.  I just RTV'd it to the side of my fuel
    can and terminated the lead in a miniature phone-plug which inserts
    into a corresponding phone-jack connected to the fill/drain switch
    on the power panel.  The pump switch is left in the "fill" position
    at all times, the pump being controlled from the power panel switch.
    The reason I wanted the switched version of the pump is because,
    if my battery/power panel should fail, I can still fuel by connecting
    to someone elses battery [or my car battery] using a pair of alligator
    test-leads.
    
    I'd have sworn the older one is a Mark-X series and the newer one
    is a Mark-XX series but I'll have to doublecheck before getting
    more specific than that.     

      |
      | |      00	 Adios,      Al
    |_|_|      ( >o
      |    Z__(O_\_	(The Desert Rat)

    
    Al, I think you answered my question - it runs on 12v and has the
    switch.  There's only one model in that category (I don't have the
    book in front of me and I forget which one).  10 years!!??!!?? 
    I'd by happy with a couple seasons after my experience with the Tower
    pump.  Think I'll give it a try - now I'm going to have to add a
    12v battery to my flight box.  That's ok, I have to lengthen it
    to add my second transmitter anyhow.  Thanks for the info -
    
    Bill

    Bill,
    
    Pornada amigo.  You might even want to consider adding a power panel
    to yer' flight box.  That way you can run yer' fuel pump, starter
    and glo-plug lead all from the single 12v motorcycle battery which
    only requires occasional charging.  Sure saves a lot aof hassle
    trying to keep up with charging/cycling many small nicad accessory
    batteries.  I use a Sonictronics panel which has the added feature
    of a glo-plug _driver_ which means the circuitry senses demand from
    the plug making inverted engine starts a snap, a _must_ for the
    MiG-3 in competition.  

      |
      | |      00	 Adios,      Al
    |_|_|      ( >o
      |    Z__(O_\_	(The Desert Rat)

    	I've been using a Royal fuel pump the past 6 months and I don't
    think much of it. At about 1/2 gallon left it doesn't seem to have the
    drawing power. I'm always blowing into the hose to prime it. Whats
    another good electric pump to get?
    
    Bob G.

    Bob,
    
    I've had excellent luck with the pumps from Sonic-Tronics...never
    had one fail, though my first one began leaking intermittently after
    about ten (10) years of constant use.  (Incidentally, I sold that
    original pump as part of a flight box and it's still in service
    2-yr.s later with no additional attention...still leaks a little 
    occasionally but it keeps on tickin'.    

      |
      | |      00	 Adios,      Al
    |_|_|      ( >o
      |    Z__(O_\_	(The Desert Rat)

Bob
 
Note 94 has a lot of info on electric pumps. I used used a Volvo windscreen 
washer pump for about 2 years, it probably still works. I have gone back to 
manual pumps for a more portable option to pumping fuel.

John

    Go to the junk yard and find about a 1967 ford product and get the
    windshield washer pump off of it.  I have use two of these for about 2
    years in Glo Fuel, Gas, and Smoke Oil and they work just great.
    
    The pumps were mounted on the fender as a seperate pump.  You will
    need to epoxy a small brass tube to one of the openings as it is too
    big for fuel line.
    
    Best part about them...they are only about $5.00