Conference 7.286::dcu

    Seems like you were a victim of someone honing in on your frequency
    whilst driving through NY or a victim of some sort of dishonest 
    member of the rental agency who chose to tell someone else that this
    auto and number were going to be available for use for the length of
    time that said auto was rented and that activation time was uncertain.
    
    What a b*tch of a thing to have to deal with these days!  Credit card
    fraud!!!  

    

    It isn't only credit card fraud in this case, it's a broader problem
    with cellular.  Consider the recent arrest of Kevin Mitnick and the
    fact that he paid no cellular bills while using it to perform his
    antics.  It was possible for him to point MIC at GTE and GTE at MIC as
    the originator of the calls causing the service charges (in this case)
    to be lost in the "loop".
    
    I suppose, given appropriate eauipment, and electronic eves dropping
    that it is possible that your cellular phone could get billed for all
    kinds of calls that you never made, much more easily than taking over
    your home phone.
    
    Bill
    

re: .2

    For a long time, plans to encrypt cellular phone communications were
    hung up due to the FBI's demand that the phone companies provide means
    for law enforcement agencies to easily tap any conversation.  They
    can't easily tap an encrypted conversation, so...  
    
    I don't know the current state of this controversy, but I do think that 
    it's insane to transmit voice messages over the air in the clear.
    
    	Larry

    This type of Cellular Phone fraud has been on the rise, especially
    in large metro areas like NY city. Supposedly, the crooks sit by
    the road side and with the proper electronic equipment can pick up
    the necessary info from your Cell Phone even if it's only turned
    on, NOT NECESSARILY IN USE, as you drive by. They then take that
    info, clone a phone, sell it for a couple of hundred bucks and the
    phone buyer uses it as long as they can before the number is
    de-activated.

    The other half of this story, which has a DCU impact, is people's
    earlier concerns and the 'ol DCU Checking/Debit card. Fraudulent
    use of this type of card can effect your checking account, your
    ability to pay bills, and your reputation with your creditors as
    your mortgage, electric, phone, etc... bill checks start to
    bounce all over town.

    Charly

I'd be more inclined to think that the car phone didn't "forget" the credit
card info and that the next renter discovered this and placed the calls.

				Steve

    RE .6
    
    Not likely, I left on a monday, the calls were initiated that Thursday
    while I still had the auto and continued till the day 'AFTER' I had
    returned the auto.  There were so many debits, (after a closer
    inspection ~200) that they were not processed till ~4 weeks later. 
    Go figure...
                                                           
    
    /Kelvin 

    Did all those EXTRA calls start after you made your call in NY???

    ;*)

    ...RE. -1
    
    
    
    	yes they did.....the auto nor the keys were out of my possesion
    	the entire trip....?
    

    I heard a rep from Cellular One describing this type of fraud. She said
    it happens in very crowded urban areas, where someone with an
    electronic device can scan vehicles with cell phones to pick up the
    codes.  She said it has to be at a major traffic intersection where
    cars are most likely going to be stopped for a few minutes, so they can
    unscramble the information they need.  Her advice was NOT to use the
    phone in these areas, and watch for someone standing on the sidewalk
    intently watching for people with phones up to their ears!  She said
    NYC was one of the worst because of volume of cars and the slow pace of
    traffic.
    Sarah

>>    phone in these areas, and watch for someone standing on the sidewalk
>>    intently watching for people with phones up to their ears! 

The phone does not have to be in use, only turned on.  As long as the phone is 
powered on, it will transmit the information they need to reprogram stolen 
phones.

//bruce

    This particular case does not appear to be 'cellular' related.  They 
    appear to be credit card, err debit card related.  The interception
    could have occured miles away from where the person was driving.
    the credit card, if swipped, sent it's code DTMP.  anyone with a 
    modified scanner could have picked it up and with shareware software
    decoded the digits.
    
    This incident is one of the examples of hwy I and others had said NO
    to the debit card.
    
    If your credit card gets stolen, or the numbers used, your past uses
    are protected, and you know about an overlimit immediately.
    But, with a mix of checks and credit card use, checks that you may have
    made out and mail prior to the unauthorized use of debit card can and
    will bounce.  and you can continue bouncing until your next statement.
    
    not for me.
    ed
    

  Re -1: Thanks for explaining the pitfalls of having a debit card. I never
really considered having one, but this has convinced me. There are lots of
ways people can get your credit card number; the cellular phone is the newest
trick.

    Re: .-1
    
    It's not that the debit card is anathema to checking account security. 
    It presents a slightly different set of risks than a credit card, but
    if you find it to be a useful tool, you can manage its risks easily
    enough once you know what they are.  
    
    I like to view notes topics like this as educational, not as means to
    dissuade people.
    
    --Pat