Conference quark::mennotes-v1

    
    
    "Having sex" is raw lust with the ultimate goal of having a brain-rush
    orgasm.
    
    "Making love" can only be done coupled with emotional attachment to the
    other person.  Their satisfaction becomes just as important, if not
    more so, than yours.  It also includes the warm and tender feelings of
    intimacy which follow the actual act itself.  In many ways, the "act"
    is only one very small part of "making love".
    
       Greg

    In addition to the base noter, may I ask:
    
    How many dudes really care if their partner is turned on?   When
    is "having sex" over for men?  When do you "fake it" and take it?
    so that your partner can just "have sex"?  Or would this now become
    "making love"?
    

    One of my pet peeves ... the use of "making love" when you really mean
    "sex".... oh well....

    Another question to add to the list .. is there anything *wrong* with
    simple, pure, S-E-X without the emotional ties of love?

    Sure, I understand and respect that some people simply cannot separate
    the two (sex and love) ... but .. there are some (myself included) who
    CAN separate the two.  There does NOT have to be an 'emotional' bond
    between myself and my partner to have sex.  Sex is fun(!), I enjoy it,
    and, I hope my partner does [no complaints, yet ;-) ] ... I darned
    sure don't have to have an emotional bond with someone to have "fun".

    Bubba

    re .2:

    wouldn't know; too few data points since my divorce 10 years ago.
    �A�A
    but it seems to me that men do care, sometimes they just don't
    realize it until after the "deed"..

    
    
    Excellent question, Jerry.
    
    No, there is nothing wrong with "SEX".  But, I prefer making love. 8-)
    
    	  GJD

>Can you make love with a person if you don't love them?

 Sure. You can have the emotional attachment required for making love without
actually being in love with somebody.

>How many dudes really care if their partner is turned on?

 Can't answer for anyone but myself, but, I do. It's more fun when your
partner's excited.

>When is "having sex" over for men?

 When the partner is satisfied or I'm too tired to continue. :-)

>When do you "fake it" and take it?

 I don't actually "fake" anything, but I have been known to relinquish
the pursuit of _another_ orgasm when appropriate.

    
    How many men and women think great sex is love?  Are men confused when
    it comes to love and sex?
    
    My heart must be in it and I would hope my male partner shared
    the same feelings I did. I agree with the point that there is
    more to making love than the act itself, it's all those feelings you
    have for your lover, friend and mate that make it what it is, and it's
    the intimate time after, the cuddling and warmth after.
    
    I just couldn't "have sex" with someone whose is probably out there
    just "having sex" with someone else.
    
    Mary
    

    
    	Again, I'll cite the "extension of one's self for the spiritual/
    emotional growth of another" definition of Love (getting a lot of
    mileage out of that today) to the question at hand.
    
    	I'd say that you're making love when you're willing to extend
    yourself for the satisfaction and feelings of your partner. This means 
    delay your own gratification for their sake - let them trust their emotions
    (desire) to you. It means respect their passion and vulnerability at their
    "moment". It means validate the invariable "spiritual" aspect of your 
    meeting. These, when given as an extra effort on your part, possibly
    well beyond your own needs, are some constituants of "making love".
    
    	I'd say that you're having sex when you dont particularly care
    for the emotions/feelings of your partner. You dont particularly care
    to extend yourself much beyond the (male) 'knee-jerk' response to having 
    intercourse and you're not willing to do much of anything that gives 
    *them* any satisfaction or validates any spiritual aspect of your meeting.

    	Making love and having sex can both happen when you're "in love"
    and with someone you're "not in love" with. It's conceivable, even in
    the most perfect marriage, that there's going to be times when you
    just feel like "having sex". Likewise, I imagine that even as a single 
    person, not having had any sex for a year, that there might be a time 
    when you happen to just meet someone and end up trully "making love".
    
    	Joe

    >	Again, I'll cite the "extension of one's self for the spiritual/
    >emotional growth of another" definition of Love (getting a lot of
    >mileage out of that today) to the question at hand.
    
    Joe - I started reading "The Road Less Travelled" a couple of weeks ago 
    - that phrase has given me a new way of looking at the love in my life...
    It's an important quote with a LOT of mileage, IMO.
    
    'gail
    
    
    

    
    This has the makings of a rathole topic like one that discusses being
    "in love."
    
    But all the love experts out there in 'note land' will have a field day
    with this topic.
    
    Emotional views are subject to everyone's personal court.
    

    The following reply has been contributed by a member of our community
    who wishes to remain anonymous.  If you wish to contact the author by
    mail, please send your message to QUARK::MODERATOR, specifying the
    conference name and note number. Your message will be forwarded with
    your name attached  unless you request otherwise.

				Steve






	I do both but the difference depends on the sex of my partner.
	I generally make love with girls. I want to know them before and have 
	a bond with them. I like to have a wide contact with them and that we 
	share a lot of things and ideas. It is not only physical but also 
	emotional.
	I like to have sex with men who are exiting or find me exiting. It is 
	not the same kind of pleasure, it is "harder" but I like it too and 
	need it. It is more physical but as for the girls, I care for the 
	feeling of my partner too. I want him to have pleasure. 
	I am sexual and like that but I don't want to live with a guy.

	It can be an answer to the question how can someone be bisexual.

    re .3, jerry
    
    > Another question to add to the list .. is there anything *wrong* with
    > simple, pure, S-E-X without the emotional ties of love?
    
    without love?  sure.  without emotional ties?  for me, nope.  good,
    down and dirty sex requires trust on my part, and trust doesn't come to
    me without emotional ties.
    
    lee (female, for those surveyors out there)

 Good way to put it, Lee. D'accord!

    
    I agree, a big part of it is trust, and I think that comes from
    being emotionally secure with your partner. And in today's society,
    that is a key factor, at least in my opinion. 
    
    Mary