Conference quark::human_relations-v1

    Friends who lie don't bother me much, unless they lie about me.

    
    Well, you could be overreacting.  After all, people are entitled to
    change their mind about things, and that doesn't mean that the first
    opinion was a lie.  Also, why should it bother you what she did on
    vacation with a female friend last year?  Why were you asking?  If she
    felt she was getting the third-degree, she may not have wanted to tell
    you everything she did, after all, it's really none of your business,
    right?
    
    On the other hand, if she is deliberately lying, you need to find out
    why.  Perhaps she feels the truth will hurt you, and therefore feels
    that it is easier to lie?  I don't advocate lying to anyone, especially
    friends, but I can understand why some people do it sometimes.  If you
    want to tackle to problem, the only thing you can do is confront her
    with it - not in an aggressive way, but just sort of "Hey, are you sure
    that's right?  The last time we spoke about this you said ...".  You
    can't really go around double-checking her stories behind her back,
    that makes you as bad as her (if she is lying).
    
    If you want to keep this friendship going you'll have to bring this out
    in the open sooner or later.
    
    Sam
    

    
    I can remember being in the friends shoes.  I was not lying.  What i
    said was the truth considering where I was at at the time.  The truth
    could change as time and I changed.
    
    Example:  I can be angry at someone one day and a week later not be
    angry with them.  Does that make the fact I was angry one day a lie? 
    No, it means when I was angry I was telling the truth and later, when
    I was no longer angry I was telling the truth.  Feelings change.  That
    doesn't mean that either feelings are a lie.
    
    As far as not telling you what she did, maybe she didn't attach as much
    importance to the issue as you did.  It may have been irrelevant to her
    and she may not have realized it was important to you.
    
    Just my thoughts.
    

    I have a female friend who routinely lies. She does it for two main
    reasons, one is pride and the other is telling you what you want to
    hear.

    I am observant and thus lying to me becomes difficult, as you must
    remain consistent to your initial lie and I have a nasty habit of
    remembering. However I value her friendship and thus tolerate her lies. 

    Mind you I never trust her and independently verify anything that she
    tells me if I am going to rely on it.

    Assuming that the lies are not harmful then I think that, "How much
    does our questioner value the friendship?" is the question that must be
    asked here.

    Jamie.

    Someone who lies, I stay away from. Weither they are a braggart, or
    trying to cover something. I see a person who has some problems. And if
    they wish not to get help for it..... Relationship is terminated.
    
    Last thing that you need is someone telling you one thing and feecies
    is about to hit you hard in the back of the head over something else.

re .0 and some others

   Truth telling is not a high priority in some cultures.   Avoiding offense
   is higher in two cultures I know.
   
   It has been demonstrated that in the U.S. where the "questioner" seems to
   be of higher status than the "answerer", the "answerer" will often adopt
   a "tell them what they want to hear" strategy.  This is a standard
   protective mechanism which is not labeled "lying" by those who practice
   it.
   
   When invited to a party in Puerto Rico, you are expected to show delight
   at the idea of being invited, even if you have a prior engagement that
   will make it impossible to attend.  RSVP is the exception here.  It would
   be grossly discourteous to say immediately that you can't make it.  (But,
   it's ok to call back later and warn the host.)
   
   Everyone has the right to some privacy, including your friend.  Why is it
   any business of yours what she did on her vacation?  If she shares it,
   fine.  But lay off the interrogations.  Even in the context of marriage
   they are resented and divisive.  In a dating relationship its clearly out
   of line, in my opinion.
   
fwiw,

Dick

    just drop the person from your life, it he/she were a "friend" he\she
    would not deceive you by lying...
    
    Don't bother.
    

    
      
       I heard a great line in a movie once;
    
      "Women lie and men are idiots".
    
     
     Sorry I couldn't resist.......      :^)
    

    
    
      All kidding aside,  ............ we all have lied before... and
    all relationships are a risk.  But if it becomes a habit, or the norm,
    end it.
    
          take care,
    

	How important are these lies to you?  Are they destructive
	lies about you, or are they misinformation that makes it
	difficult to navigate the relationship?

	I would never just "drop" a friendship, unless it was the
	appropriate way of maintaining the friendship.  Often,
	friends have behaved in ways that I don't understand until
	much later.  If I "dropped" the friendship, I would have
	lost the understanding and the friend.

	Stay friends.  Understand that the person may not always
	tell the truth and has her reasons, even if the aren't
	logical.  Keep whatever distance you require, but don't 
	close doors.

	Unless you need to.

	-Jim

    Do the human thing.  Forgive as much as you can.  We are all falible.  
    We lie to ourselves all the time, never mind people we are close to.  
    Sometimes people need a screen to hide behind.  Should this person hurt 
    you constantly by a lack of truth, ask yourself if the friendship would 
    be worth *your* truthfulness in confronting her and asking "why"?  If 
    her "lies" are simply the manifestation of someone who likes her private 
    life private, accept what friendship she can give, and perhaps in time she
    can give you more.  Openness is a gift not everyone has, and
    the truth poorly used can be as evil a weapon as any lie ever was.
    
    Mary-Michael
    
    

    re. -.11-- I love your last line, "truth poorly used can be as much a
    weapon as a lie ever was."  (May be a paraphrase--I haven't figured out
    how to get into the previous note buffer from this PC and thus can't
    see the exact words on my screen.)
    
    Thanks.
    Karen

         Your friend may be a compulsive liar.  Imo, talking about it is
    the only way to go.  She may need a friend for support if she is a
    compulsive liar and you might be that person.  And it's not always easy
    being a friend to someone with obsessive/compulsive disorders.
    
                                                 Capt. Scott

> Part of her problem too is that she's not very communicative or 
> expressive. 
    
    I would imagine that people who have a hard time communicating are more
    apt to express themselves inaccurately, or cut corners to avoid too
    much explanation, or leave things out of narrative, or overstate vague
    temporary feelings.
    
    If anything, I'm overcommunicative, and I've still fallen into such
    traps. Sometimes it seems like all communication is just one shade of
    lie or another -- personalities are too complicated and unclear to
    completely delineate with words. 
    
    Of course, some people distort stuff deliberately and with malice, but
    it sounds like your friend might still be given the benefit of the
    doubt.
    
    Ray