Conference quark::human_relations-v1

My guess is you won't be given a chance to try to be a single parent.

Our society is not likely to agree that you can raise two girls without a woman
in the house.  Even if they were boys, you would probably have trouble getting
custody.  Not that I agree, but I think that's real world.

Given that you won't get custody without a fight, your choices boil down to

	1) Let your wife have custody.

	2) Take the kids through a nasty court battle for custody as part
	   of the divorce proceedings.

My vote is for 1) because the kids are not going to be well served by all the
exposure to the social-legal system.  There is even a risk that under 2), 
neither you nor your wife would get custody.  Talk to your lawyer.

Dick

    Get a laywer RIGHT NOW!  You'll want to document the fact that the 
    children are living with you now.
    
    You also might want to ask yourself why you are going out of your
    way to help out your soon-to-be-ex wife.
    
    		-John Bishop

    You need a good lawyer to protect your interests in your children and
    to help you understand your situation (which is deep s__t).
    
    A good lawyer is:
    
    	- friendly, persuasive, and assertive in court.  It doesn't matter 
    	  what he or she is like in his or her own office.  I'm not sure,
    	  but many judges are men and they may be more receptive to a 
    	  woman lawyer.  Don't know if there are any stats on that but I've
    	  some excellent woman lawyers in action and,  even in a court,
    	  human nature is human nature.
    
    	- honest and pragmatic.  ( Yes, pearls are difficult to find, but
    	  do the best you can.)  If your lawyer paints a rosy picture of
    	  custody battles,  he or she is thinking of the fee,  not your
    	  chances of success.
    
    	- familiar with the law.  (This point is less important than the 
    	  previous two.  Don't let anyone fool you: a court-room
          presentation in a sales presentation.  You're selling yourself
          and what a good person and parent you are.)
    
    Chances are, that regardless what happens, if you keep in touch with
    your children and if you can be there for them,  you will still have 
    something nice out of life even if it is less than what you've wanted. 

   She has made it abundantly clear what she wants and what she is going to
   do.  You have said that you believe you can work things out if she wanted
   to.  She has spoken and acted -- she says NO.

   Start from there.  Until you do, your children are prime targets for a
   battle nobody really wants.


   							Terza

    Chances are you will not get custody unless your wife gives them up.
    I don't know too many women that would do that. The best you can hope
    for is to go for joint custody. This is from someone that's been in
    custody court three separate times. My ex went for the kids.
    If I were you I would start looking for a lawyer and a Good one.
    Good luck

    
    
    Get the kids back in the marital home now.  As long as you remain there
    with the kids you have a better chance of getting custody of them.
    I would also post this note in the non custodial notes file.  You would
    get alot of good feedback from folks who have experienced this first
    hand.
    
    Good luck,
    Michele

    
    Divorce is never easy, no matter who wants it.  But it is hardest
    of all on the children.  The only thing you and your wife seem to
    have in common any more is that you both love your kids.
    
    If you can keep it from becomming a grudge match and think of what is
    best for the children it might help.  I think joint custody is great
    when both parents have a loving relationship with their children.
    Also having them back in their "home" with regular schedules could
    take some of the stress off.
    
    Get legal advice as soon as possible.  You never know what advise
    your wife is getting, and you might find your situation changing 
    overnight.
    
    Being a single parent is difficult whether you are male or female.
    I have been a single parent for eight years and when it would get
    particularly hard to deal with things, I would remember what it
    was like before the divorce, and know that we are better off now.  
    Besides, my reward has been raising a great daughter.  
    I would never go back.
    
    
    Judy
    
    

    Some background.  My son's father and I separated when he was 5, just
    before he started first grade.  We had "normal" custody arrangements
    (Mom during the week, Dad alternate weekends and alternate holidays)
    for one year, and then had joint physical custody for 6 years.  At that
    point Dad moved out of state, and the child chose to stay in the known
    school and social situation and live with Mom.  We did not get our
    final divorce decree until 3 1/2 years after Dad left the original
    marital home.  The long time between separation and divorce was at
    least partially so we could work out custody and visitation *without*
    the courts and lawyers making it an adversarial process.  We did
    consult a lawyer during the first six months for an uncontested
    settlement, and he did help us with writing up what we wanted and
    bringing up issues we had not considered.
    
    In your position, I would ask for joint physical custody.  Let your
    children's mother know that you still love and want to care for your
    children.  Absolutely, take them back for now and continue to care for
    them.  Take every opportunity you are given to have them living with
    you, cared for by you, go to their school and meet their teachers,
    participate in their activities.  If you wind up in a court fight (and
    I hope you don't, because they are almost always destructive), this
    will be very powerful evidence in your favor that you are involved with
    your children in a way that many fathers are not.
    
    In our case, we swapped weeks.  My son went to school from one house on
    Monday morning, and came home to the other house on Monday afternoon. 
    This had the advantage of giving all of us a "neutral time" between
    homes.  It was a regular schedule, so the child knew what to expect. 
    It tended to confuse the school a little, but they learned to cope. 
    Other families with joint physical custody have had other patterns
    which have worked for them.
    
    Good luck to you.  If you've got any other questions, feel free to
    write me off line.  (My son is now 18 and turned out fine.)
    
    Alison 

    There is alot of good advice being given here but I thought the author
    wanted to hear from single fathers.
    
    I am a single father of a 4 year old girl.  Cori and I have been on our
    own since she was 13 months.  I will be glad to talk to you if you
    want.  My mail node is CSC32::T_PARMELEE.  
    
    My advice would be to document EVERYTHING.  Try to keep the girls
    livestyle as unchanged as possible.  Get involved in all aspects of the
    girls lives as possible.  They will need a good stable environment. 
    The court system will look at who can best provide this environment. 
    The children are what's important here.  
    
    Call or write if you want to talk.
    
    Tom

    Hi. I'm a single father who has been separated 2 1/2 years, not yet
    divorced, and I've had my 4 year-old son almost 1/2 time since then. My
    situation is not yet resolved, but I've learned a lot and I'll be glad 
    to talk with you. I'm at GVA01::LANGTON. 
    
    Theo 

    I am a single father and have been for 6 years. My younger son is 11
    and the older is 14. In april my oldest went to live with his mother
    because he wanted to. I also have a 24 year old daughter living with
    me. She has been with me since she was 10.

    Hi,
    
    2 daughters aged 7 and 9 have been living with me for almost 2 years
    after I filed for a divorce.  My divorce became final last June, but
    the battle didn't end there... There were 2 more court Hearings, and
    the most recent one was the most brutal...
    
    Yes, I still have custody...  It IS possible for the Father to have
    custody but, NOT WITHOUT the EMOTIONAL and FINANCIAL EXPENSES of 
    proving to the Vermont Family Court, that the Mother of the children
    is either unfit, chemically dependent on drugs, crazy, abuse the
    children, or whatever... 
    
    DOCUMENT, DOCUMENT, DOCUMENT...!!  Your children will LOVE YOU and 
    RESPECT YOU because THEY NEED to HAVE THAT KNOWLEDGE and sense of
    SECURITY that you ARE THERE FOR THEM and ALWAYS will be.....
    
    Yes, my EX has screwed me many, many times...even put the children in
    the middle... but, I documented things to the court and she has a court
    order to refrain from putting them in the middle between her and I.
    
    Yes, it's EXPENSIVE,...and YES, divorce is ugly... BUT, the IMPORTANT
    thing to remember is that your children need to KNOW that you are
    there for them from the day they were born till the day you die...
    
    Hang in tough...
    John
    

    John,
    Congratulations on getting custody of your children.  You deserve many
    kudos for going after what you want and hanging in there to get it.
    
    Karen