Conference noted::equitation

    my last note asking what i can use betwwen the hoof and the pad..
    i meant to ask is there anything other than pine tar or 
    pinetar with something else?
    
    

    Hi wendy,
    
    I don't think I'd change the hoof angle.  That would just put
    additional strain on the tendons and ligaments. You may cause
    more problems than you'll cure.    Some horses just have tender feet.  
    Leaving more sole on the foot when she's trimmed may help.
    
    Pads come in two basic types - a full pad which covers the entire
    sole of the hoof, and a rim pad that is in the shape of a shoe
    and leaves the sole and frog exposed. What type you pick depends
    on the problem you're trying to cure and your horses environment.
    If you are trying to protect her from rough terrain, I'd use a full
    pad, but if what you need is some relief from concussion try a rim
    pad. Of the performance horses I dealt with that needed pads, most
    got along fine with a rim pad. Also, some manufcturers make aluminum shoes
    with a "pad" already bonded to the underside of the shoe. These
    are mostly for race horses.
    
    The materials used in pads are leather or plastic. Leather is
    traditional and somewhat less expensive, but tends to compress
    and loose it's shock absorbing properties.  Used as a rim pad,
    it tends to looses it's shape. There's a nice "plastic" pad on 
    the market (equithane) that a lot of jumper and performance
    horses use.  It's expensive, but nice for absorbing shock. 
    
    One more thing about pads - you tend to loose shoes more frequently
    than without pads.  Also, I don't turn horses with full pads out
    -especially in mud- since you can't clean their feet.    

    Hi Wendy,
    
    I am surprised that your blacksmith would not put on the pads.  It
    would mean more $$$$ for him.  I have always used pads on my horse.
    My blacksmith used the black plastic type and puts hemp and Forshners
    hoof packing underneath.  I have never had any problems with thrush or
    anything getting underneath the pads.  I have heard of cases where a
    small stone or sliver got underneath the pad and caused some havoc.
    Some blacksmiths use silicone under the pads.  
    
    Maybe you could explain the problem you are having with your horses
    feet to the blacksmith.  Be very diplomatic (let him tell you your
    horse needs pads) Tell him that you have had the vet check
    the horses feet and legs already and that you need his help to 
    straighten out the problem.  He should be more than willing to
    accomodate you.  After all you are paying the bills.  If he still
    will not cooperate, than maybe you need to find a new blacksmith.   
    Your horses feet and legs are nothing to fool with.  You know the
    old saying "No Hoof No Horse".
    
    Good Luck,
    
    Wendy

	 My sister's  horse  needed pads in front all year round 'cuz of
     thin  soles.   We  used  silicone  between  the  hoof and pad as an
     additional shock absorber.  As far as turnout with full pads on, it
     didn't cause a problem for us.  He stayed thrush-free for 5-6 years
     that  we  had  him  (r.i.p), and for a few of those years, he would
     occasionally  escape  from  his  pasture  and  go  wandering in the
     neighboring swamp.

	 Silicone is  a  little  more expensive han oakum (at least with
     the  farriers I have used) and you have to be a little more careful
     with  it;  you  have to wait for it to set before riding the horse.
     You  don't want it to squeeze out from between the pad and hoof.  I
     usually  played  it  safe  and didn't ride the day he got shod.  It
     takes  different  lengths of time to set, depending on the weather,
     temperature, etc.  

	 We also  only  used  the  regular  plastic  pads  on  him.  The
     leather,  although  'natural'  tends  to  dry and harden as it gets
     older.  The plastic pads wear very well.

	 As far  as what you should put on your horse, you, your vet and
     your  farrier  need  to  work that out.  The three of you know what
     work  your horse is doing and what her problems are.  Messing wih a
     horses  legs  and  feet, I feel, is best left to those who care for
     them professionally.

	 As far  as  the  equithane  pads,  I  read  an  article on them
     somewhere (Chronicle of the Horse, Practical Horseman, I'm not sure
     which)  and  the  impression  I got was that they had a tendency to
     break  down fairly quickly with the amount pounding a horse can put
     on them.  I myself use sorbothane (same stuff) insoles in my hiking
     boots  and think they're great as far as shock absorbtion, but they
     do  tend  to  break  down  after  100  miles  or  so.   Getting wet
     frequently seems to speed the process up.


	 Does your horse wear shoes with pads in the winter? If so, does
     she  go  any  better  in the winter than in the summer? That should
     give you a clue as to whether or not pads will help at all.

kathy

    well. i forgot to say i wanted full pads...
    
    thanks for the different plastic pads and what to use inbetween..
    
    i'm getting a new shoer...
    
    
    i do need to raise the heel lower the toe, to take stress off the
    tendon no?
    
    btw what is tendonitis? (sp?) and could cil' have it?
    
    

    If your horse has tendonitis your vet should have found it. It is
    inflammation of the tendons. If only the soles of the feet are hurting
    the pads should clear it up though if bruises are present it could
    take several weeks for the horse to become fully sound after putting
    them on. I would have a real problem with a farrier who could not
    give a good logical reason why a horse with sore feet should not
    have pads. I believe good communication with vets and farriers is
    important for my kids health, I don't tell them their job, but they
    still have to tell me what they are doing and why since I am paying
    for their services. That way we all become better horse care people.
    
    Sandy
    

she was sore up front (stiff)
    i got sick of pulling her from claases cuz she was off.
    
    the only thing i could think of was tell the shoer to put pads on..
    he soad i would be doin more damage to her feet.. eeeeeerrrrrrrrrrrrrr
    the vet couldnt find anything.. (nothing)
    if it is tendonitis should i give bute? should i work her outta
    it? should i also be wrapping her legs for work as well as standing
    in the stall?
    (shes not stocked up and no sswelling in any of the legs)
    
   

    If your vet checked her out and there is no swelling in her legs -
    forget the tendonitis.  What part of the country are you in?  I am
    in New England and I can tell you that if my horse did not have pads
    on and I was working him on hard frozen and sometimes rough terrain, 
    his feet would be sore.  How much work has this horse been getting?  
    On what type of surface?
    
    Sounds like some pads and a few days off would correct your problem.
    I would not give her any bute or medications unless your vet said it
    was necessary.  You could try to pack her feet with some hoof packing.
    Some people do that once a week or so to condition the frog and soles.
    You pack the feet with hoof packing (I have used Forshner's), press it
    in the heel, and around the frog, then press newspaper on top into the
    packing.  The newspaper holds it in place and helps to keep any debris
    from sticking to the packing.  You should read the directions on the 
    container and possibly get advice from your vet. This would be done
    only to condition the soles and provide some temporary comfort for the
    horse.  It is the same stuff that my blacksmith packs the hoof with
    before he puts the pad and shoe on.
    

    You probably just have a horse that's a little footsore but before
    you start giving her bute please check with your vet. Nobody
    but your vet should be recommending the use of a perscription drug
    - especially not on the basis of these notes. Wraps when riding
    can't hurt.
    
    If you do have tendonitis or bursitis, she's not going to work out
    of the pain/stiffness and you'll just cause more damage. These
    condidtions are inflamations of the tendons or joints and work will
    increase this inflamation. In either case you should be able to
    feel some heat or swelling in the lower leg.
    
    The one front end lameness cause that hasn't been brought up yet
    is navicular.  In early stages, the bone deterioration won't show
    up on an xray. The angle changes your vet recommended are also
    used to relieve the pain caused by this disease. I'd  question
    a vet who couldn't find anything wrong and then gave me a treatment
    for a problem he couldn't identify in my horse.

    RE:equithane pads -
    I get one (maybe two) shoeings with a set of pads.  The rim pads
    don't seem to wear as well as the full pads.
    
    -maureen
    

    
    thanks wendy. i thought that but didnt know..
    vet thought she might* have a touch of it..
    shes been out but not worked.. i havent seen her raise h*ll outside,
    so she really hasnt been pounding her toes down..
    
    i wanna bute her up, to releive some pain and any imflammation.
    vet just called and said that it woukd be a good idea.
    just to get her rested some... 
    
    the i will go with the best pads there is!
    
    yay.. i can barrelrace!!!
    i thought i was gunna have to cancel out my plans for hauling new
    england.. i wanna haul pro soooo bad..
    
    btw! i got in the mail honor roll award
    	wendy-juanita matthews
    	Cue Tee McCue
    
    `tenth in the nation
    
    	in road hack!
    
    		wendy o'
    

re: .10

>>    so she really hasnt been pounding her toes down..
    
	 I assume  this means she isn't wearing any shoes right now.  If
     foot-sore  is  what  she  really  is, then shoeing with pads should
     help,  although,  as  someone  else said, if she is bruised, it may
     take a while to see results.

	 If the  problem  is not in her feet, or not _just_ in her feet,
     you may need to investigate further.

    re.last

    	bad choice of words she has shoes now... i just havent seen
    her rearing up and really pounding on the soles, like the others
    in the barn..
    
    how do they check out the joints and tendos? is there an ultrasound now?
    
        

    the mare turned out to have a bruised sole..
    the farrier still doesnt wanna put pads on if she doesnt need them,
    he says they will just cause more problems..
    
    that padding between the sole/frog and the pad, the shoer
    said it was silicone? and it took about 24 hrs to set?
    someone in the conference uses it, i was told by my shoer 
    is was toxic, and he doesnt use it..
    he uses some type of jute looking ropetype padding..dont know the
    name of it.
    

re:.13

>    the mare turned out to have a bruised sole..
>    the farrier still doesnt wanna put pads on if she doesnt need them,
>    he says they will just cause more problems..
    
	 If she  continues  to bruise, or the bruises don't go away, you
     may want to consider having pads put on


>    that padding between the sole/frog and the pad, the shoer
>    said it was silicone? and it took about 24 hrs to set?
>    someone in the conference uses it, i was told by my shoer 
>    is was toxic, and he doesnt use it..

	 If it's  so  toxic,  why is it used so much? It's not as though
     it's  easy  for them to ingest the stuff.  It's not uncommon to see
     competition  horses  with  pads,  and  plenty of them have silicone
     under  those  pads.   I  guess no one bothered to tell those horses
     they were gonna die - they just keep on truckin'.

>    he uses some type of jute looking ropetype padding..dont know the
>    name of it.
    
	oakum.

    re <: kathy i agree with u 100 percent..
    
    i feel she should have pads.. period..
    i like jack alot but get irriated when he feels my horse doesnt
    need pads. it could have saved me 200.00 on xrays..
    we talked about a pad that just fits where the shoe goes, i feel
    it sense less, and its its to cut down on the shock then i feel
    if the horse is bothered  full pads hould be used (just personal
    opinion)
    
    
    the toxic thing i thought i should pass on, i that it would be
    interesting to bring it up here..
    
    

    I think I'd be irritated with Jack, too.  Unless he's got a
    very specific reason for not wanting to put pads on (besides it's
    more work or he just doesn't like them) he should do as you ask.
    After all it is your horse and he is in a service business. It's
    not like you're asking him to do something unethical or unhealthy.
    
    It might just be worth it to find a more cooperative farrier.
    
    -maureen
    

  re;last
    wow... !! thanks for the input! hes a good farrier (imo) he found the
    bruise (he explained it similar to a blood blister a person would
    have) the vet couldnt find anything, he is the best vet i* have
    found around the nashua area...(hes from out west so i think thats
    why i really trusted him) however i think i have lost my trust in
    him since a farrier found it and not the vet.. another thing is
    that there was a new vet that started working with him and she was
    off the rockingham track , so i would think she would have experience
    to dig deeper if the xrays and that pressure they apply on the hoof
    for tenderness didnt really show anything..
    anyway he took the pressure off the hoorf wall and the hoof will
    start to break away (the damaged part), he siad we caught it just
    in time.. oh well.. we'll have to wait on the pads, i wanna get
    this cleared up b 4 we put pads on, but i also dont want the same
    thing happening again..
    .

    My farrier uses pads with oakum.  I have had front shoes with pads
    for over a year on my  horse (I do competetive trail riding) without
    any problem.  We do a lot of miles through rocks and water.
    
    Hope you're back in business soon.

    Has anyone ever used shoes with tungsen carbide studs 'pressed' on them?
    
    My farrier has recommended I give them a try this year.  I'd never
    heard of them before.  From his description, these are *not* the
    screw-in stud set up commonly used by eventers (they are not
    removable), but rather small studs 'pressed' onto a steel shoe.  
    They supposedly offer more grip than a flat shoe but are not as grabby as 
    borium.  He recommends them for my mare because 1) I do an average of
    60~ trail miles a week and last year was wearing the shoes so fast that
    they had to be replaced every 4 weeks, and 2) a certain percentage of
    those miles are on paved roads, which as well all know can be slippery
    - especially when wet!.  The trails I ride around home are very rocky
    in places, and the organized rides I enter cover a wide variety of
    terrain, including some very rocky, hilly areas. 
    
    He feels I can go 6 weeks between shoeings with these new shoes, and they 
    will offer more grip on tar than flat steel.  They cost more (which is 
    not a complaint, providing I find them worth it), but if we dont' totally 
    destroy the studs between shoeings, they can be removed from the old 
    shoes and put on a new set at no cost.    
    
    Has anyone else heard of/used these for a horse in heavy work?  I'd be
    interested in hearing about any good/bad experiences anyone has had
    with them!
    
    

    
    	Isn't tungsten carbide the 'long name' for borium?

    I dont' believe so, no.  I may have mis-quoted his name for the
    metal used, though.  But it's defineatly different from borium.  I'll
    have to ask my husband, he works with metals all time - I'll ask
    if I have misquoted the farrier!