Conference nlfdc::linux-users

    Anyone have an idea how to make sedt work in an xterm using the EDT
    style mapping? I can't seem to get the numlock working right. Am I the
    only one?
    
    Pete  

    I've gotten it part of the way there.
    
    I execute the following commands after starting X windows:
    
        xmodmap -e "keysym Num_Lock = KP_F1"
        xmodmap -e "keysym F12 = Num_Lock"
    
    This enables F12 as the NumLock key, and make NumLock the
    PF1-equivalent.  I haven't gotten around to doing PF2 or PF3 yet.
    
    BTW, the NumLock must be ON in order for the keypad to perform
    properly.
    
    -- Russ

    Spurred on by this note, I'm now testing:
    
        xmodmap -e "keycode  63 = KP_F3"
    
    which looks good for making the keypad asterisk into a PF3 key.
    
    -- Russ

    I've tried all sorts of other stupid keyboard tricks to get this
    working. I agree. Success is great motivator. 
    
    
    Do not presume that using XTERM modifiers in the .Xdefaults will work.
    I've been that miserable route. It doesn't work. BTW, this is a problem
    with the LINUX mappings, not SEDT. Running a remote terminal in a vax
    and running VMS SEDT suffers the same issues from LINUX X.
    
    I have a really neat X package call xkeycaps that draws a keyboard on
    the screen to test mappings. It will also allow you to define new keys
    but thats not quite as easy as it sounds. Scrolling through a bunch of
    choices in a gui is ok if you don't know exactly what you want. But if
    you wantto do a quick modmap change, use mod map.
    
    I can post the sources if anyone is interested.
    
    Pete

    Here's my latest cut at it:
    
    if test $DISPLAY
      then
        xmodmap -e "keysym Num_Lock = KP_F1"
        xmodmap -e "keysym F12 = Num_Lock"
        xmodmap -e "keysym KP_Divide = KP_F2"
        xmodmap -e "keysym KP_Multiply = KP_F3"
        xmodmap -e "keycode 106 = Find"
        xmodmap -e "keycode 107 = Select"
    fi
    
    This gives you NumLock on the F12 key, PF1 on NumLock, PF2 on "/", PF3
    on "*", Find on Insert, and Select on Delete.
    
    I added the Find/Select stuff so I could use the Find key in TMS (the
    travel/expense system).
    
    
    re: .16
    
    Love to see the program.  Can you post a pointer?
    
    -- Russ

    Hmmm.  You know, for keys that work perfectly in the non-xwindows
    environment, this shouldn't be so hard. Obviously, Xwindows DECVT
    emulators are only close approximations due to keyboard variations.
    
    	I guess this has turned into the "How to get an XTERM to act 
    	like a VT200 so we can run VT200 applications" note. While SEDT
    	definitely falls into this category, I other see far reaching benefits
    	to solving the problem that SEDT suffers from.
    
    	As a side note, I lost touch with Anker's developments around the
    time that he developed a NEW keyboard option that made it more
    programmable and less dependent on the VT200 style keyboard. As
    a result, trying to get SEDT to work in the NEW keyboard mode
    appears harder than learning a totally new editor. 
    
    My interim and possibly long term solution is to  change my 
    $TERM variable to VT220 and keep the editor I know and love. All 
    this craziness still seems easier because I'm not just fixing SEDT,
    I'm fixing my telnet sessions to DEC hosts.
    
    	I had used the examples from previous notes to get some of my
    favorite features running and will continue to test new keys with the
    help of this note.
    
    I'll post the xkeycaps source tar file. It will be in anonymous FTP on
    dirk.alf.dec.com /pub directory. (not forever, but for a little while)
    
    Pete
    
    	

    Have you ever considered or tried using Emacs?
    
    Emacs, to users of fancy keyboards, like the LK series used on our old
    VT terminals, may have seemed complex at one time or another.  I know
    that when I first tried Emacs, way back in the '80s, I then thought it
    was too slow and cumbersome to learn at first.
    
    Around '89 I took another look at it.  Up to that time I had used sedt
    to, as many suggest, run in many different environments.  By then,
    workstations had gotten fast enough to handle the previously slow
    interpreted code that Emacs runs.  I found that, to get started, I
    could emulate vi or EDT using already provided Emacs routines, by
    loading scripts written in Emacs Lisp, known as Elisp.  This turned out
    to be all I needed.
    
    From there, I generally used EDT mode to get going, but the first thing
    I did was write a program called new-wps.el, stealing the sources from
    edt.el that come with GNU Emacs, and writing a mockup of the WPS
    keypad.  (Even though I am a software type, I had gotten used to the
    WPS keypad, standarizing on it because it had been the default in the
    old, old DECmail days, and then again in the All-In-1 days of WPS+.  So
    I used a WPS emulator, written by Gim Hom in the TPU language, the guts
    of which was eventually pulled into the base EVE text editor, written
    in TPU).
    
    I had always liked the extensibility of TPU, the text processing
    language used to build EVE, the successor to EDT, LSE, the language
    sensitive editor, and NOTES, all '80s vintage VAX products.  I liked
    the fact that sedt could run on so many platforms.  But eventually, I
    found that for the platforms I was using, it was easier to get Emacs
    kits in a timely fashion, and they actually had a great deal of
    functionality.  In fact, one could write Emacs macros or Emacs lisp
    scripts to perfectly emulate sedt!!! (although I've not seen sedt
    specifically emulated).
    
    With the vast majority of systems out there having some kind of
    graphical window capability (either X-Motif, OpenLook, or Microsoft
    Windows), Emacs becomes functional to the casual user.  Things like cut
    and paste can be done just like they are done in any of the window
    system notepad or editing programs.  Deleting a word, sentence, or
    paragraph can be done by some simple mouse manipulations.  If, however,
    you are a power typer, you can select any one of a number of styles,
    including various versions of vi emulation, ranging from an almost
    perfect emulation of vi, but taking little advantage of Emacs, to one
    that looks mainly like Emacs but gives you some of the basic vi key
    bindings - this package is called viper.
    
    There are also multiple EDT emulations out there.  The old one is
    called edt.el, the newer one is called tpu.el.  The newer one is an EDT
    keypad emulation, but it is actually an emulation of EVE running the
    EDT keypad.
    
    My point: Emacs is extremely flexible, it has many, many modes out
    there already written and supported, and they work almost flawlessly. 
    Emacs is SO extensible, that once you learn the capabilities -
    especially the macros and Elisp, you can WRITE YOUR OWN EDITOR if you
    so desire.  What's out there is outstanding and it has never failed me.
    
    One somewhat newer development is that of XEmacs.  It is based on GNU
    Emacs, but has evolved in somewhat different directions.  I find XEmacs
    to run somewhat slower than GNU Emacs, but has much better graphics
    support, tighter application integration, and has all the other
    advantages of GNU Emacs.  On a fast system, the speed is a wash.
    
    GNU Emacs has the advantage that it can run on VMS, ULTRIX, Digital
    UNIX, Linux and all other known variants of UNIX, Windows NT, Windows
    95, and has numerous clones and look alikes that run on even more
    platforms.
    
    If you are primarily an office user, I could see using something else -
    maybe a de-facto standard like Microsoft Word as your word processor of
    choice.  But if you are a software developer, especially if you want to
    know how to do stuff OUTSIDE of the Digital world (that should be in
    all of our minds, as Digital seems intent on becoming an iron vendor
    and outsourcing almost all software development), if I were you, I'd
    learn Emacs, even if I didn't love it.
    
    For me, I can do anything I ever did in sedt just as easily in Emacs,
    and I run it on ALL of the platforms mentioned.  I still like sedt, but
    Emacs is now the editor I use for the majority of my daily tasks.
    
    FWIW,
    Brian (the text editing "conehead")  24-FEB-1997 19:11:53