Conference terri::cars_uk

    Steve,
    
    Maybe you forgot to switch off the "Williams" traction contol 
    system!!!!!!!!!!!!!    8-))
    
    POL..
    
    Then again you may have your rev limiter set at 800 revs when cold!!!!

    Or Using Australian Petrol.... you know the stuff they use that gives a
    surge of power at low speeds to get out of the holes caused by
    the Kangaroo's!
    
    Bob

    Steve,

    I've developed a similar problem with my RS Fiesta.

    When cold, the engine always takes 2 goes to start. The first time it
    starts but splutters and then dies. The second it starts ok but its
    like it runs on 3 cylinders until it warms up.

    Despite two attempts by Ralphs to fix it by increasing the mixture
    of the injection system, the problem still remains.

    I think this may be a trait of the Ford 1.6 i engine.

    Anyway the RS dealer at Chaundlers Ford is getting it next.

    Roy

                                                                   

    
    I enquired about the same thing. Apparently the technical term
    is "lean burn stumble". Yes guys its true, I am not pulling
    your tadgers.
    
    Its to do with mating an EFi system to the old CVH engine. The
    two don't quite match.
    
    JN.

Re. 4

Is there a fix ? Or is it "expected behaviour".

Presumably the new Zeta engine is OK.

Roy

    I've experienced a similar problem with a BMW... ie the 'only firing on
    three cylinders' bit. The situation got so bad that the engine would
    actually cut out as soon as the foot was lifted off the accelerator.
    Finally the car would not start at all and had to be towed to the
    nearest BMW garage. There the problem was diagnosed to the 'idling
    valve' and once said item was replaced the car was perfectly well
    again.
    
    Regard
    
    Stephen

    This is the exact problem I'm having with my Orion 1.6i '86 now. In the
    morining it only wants to idle at about 500 rpm, and sounds like its
    firing on three cylinders. Once I get the rev over 2500 its sounds
    fine. Once its been reved up a few times it idles at about 1000 rpm
    which is about right. Once the engine has warmed up correctly it idle
    happily are 800 rpm but is still a little bit rough, the engine does a
    little dance around the engine bay, making the whole car wobbly.
    
    Neil
    
    P.S. This car does not have an EFI injection system, but the mechanical
    K-jetronics system by Bosch.

    My XR3i Cab is suffering from a similar problem.  2 visits to Gowrings
    in Wokingham have yielded nothing due to the intermittent nature of the
    problem.  I'm taking the car in tonight and they will keep it for a
    couple of days and hopefully experience (and fix !) the problems I've 
    been having.
    
    Will let you know the outcome.
    
    
    
    Nev.

    re:Kangaroo 1.6i
    
    I have the same on my wife's XR3i cabrio. Morning starting Ok but lumpy
    until warm or revved up; K-jetronic system seems OK, injectors cleaned
    with fuel tank additive, recent 30K mile service. Will be interested in
    any outcome from Gowrings visit.
    
    Colin
    

Why not just check the spark is getting to the spark
plug first and if so, clean the spark plugs.

It works on the older cars I've owned (and still do) 
where there is no engine management unit to blame.

tp

    Hi,
    I had the "idling on 3 cylinders when cold started" problem appear
    every other day in my Golf GTI (again with K-Jetronic).
    
    I renewed the plugs (they had done 20K miles, but didn't look too
    guilty), and lavished a new HT lead set.  I have yet to see the
    problem since.   Touch wood.
    
    Rob.
    
    p.s. Ouch, the shelded HT leads were 27 pounds from the VW dealer!

    
    I don't think the problem with my Cab is so basic.  Last monday (10th)
    it had a full 36K service which included replacement of all plugs/
    leads/HT etc and cam belt.  The problem is still there.  I'm
    particularly keen to get it fixed soon as the car is just about to
    undergo a 3k excursion around France at the end of the month.
    
    A friend tells me that there is a known problem with Ford injection
    systems '86 onwards which dealers are reluctant to admit to (why ?).
    
    
    Nev.

    
    I had a 1.6i '87 Orion which is still in the family and has done
    110,000 miles with no problems, apart from a burnt valve (which I
    suspect was a result of trying unleaded petrol) and a dodgy lead
    connection on the coil.
    
    With respect to the cold start problem which seems to be a fault with
    the injection system, is the cold start valve working?
    
    Chris
    

    
    This problem, I've been reliably informed, is common with
    ALL EFi injection systems mated to the old CVH engine. This
    engine has been around for just over 10 years abd quite simply
    the comment is "you can't just add a modern EFi system to an
    old engine design without modifying the engine inlet ports 
    and combustion chamber design."
    
    The ZETA unit has long been awaitied. Ford CVH engines have
    been out of the running for a long time. EFi or carbs, the 
    engine has always been known as a course engine.
    
    JN.

�    engine has been around for just over 10 years abd quite simply
�    the comment is "you can't just add a modern EFi system to an
�    old engine design without modifying the engine inlet ports 
�    and combustion chamber design."
    
    I find this a very strange comment.
    
    How a simple injection system (such as the Bosch K-jobby) is
    going to be affected by an 'old' design of intake/combustion setup
    is beyond me.  Have you any other comments/info to back this up ?
    
    The Manta has a very old engine design (much older than the CVH)
    and that has K-Jetronic fitted to fairly good effect.
    
    Even though port and combustion chamber design is old, the principles
    of getting a fuel/air mix into the cylinder haven't changed.  If the
    injection system makes a better mix than a carburettor system, then I
    don't see how a poor chamber layout will hurt this.  I can see how a
    poor chamber will not combust properly if the fuel/air is not mixed
    correctly - but that wouldn't hurt a change for carb to injection.
    
    J.R.

    On the way home on Monday night the car (Orion 1.6i '86 with rough
    idling) decided that it would not start, to be more specific it
    sufferred from total power failure. It turned out that the battery was
    dry i.e. no acid in it!. Now back to the point of the note, once a new
    battery had been fitted all my rough idling problems had gone. I can
    only conclude from this that there was not enough power in the system
    when idling to power all the electrical equipment under the bonnet. So
    go and check your batteries.....
    
    Neil

    Well Gowrings have sorted it.
    
    A new distributor has been fitted, severe problems with Adv/Ret
    mechanism.
    
    
    Nev.

    
    
    RE .15
    
    JR. Don't ask me matey, I'm just repeating what was told to me 
    down the phone. Another thing that I laughed at was the old 850
    and 1100 Fiestas' engine was the old Anglia engine more or less.
    
    All these Fords with EFi can't all have naff distribs. Can they ?
    
    
    
    JN.