Conference terri::cars_uk

have you tried to get a quote from Swinton?
they seem to be pretty good for cars such as these and ages such as yours

failing that, get a copy of 'Car' (i'm not a shareholder honest :-) and try
some of the 'hi-performance' insurance companies that advertise their wares
there.

i'd be amazed if you manage to wangle any ncb for being a good boy on daddies


>>insurance.?  Is there a way I can prove I've not caused an accident in over
>>3 years and subseqently receive the NCD ?  Any insurance

most companies won't want to insure you anyway because you're under 25 (for 
these cars)

and the ones that will cover you will want you to have a clean driving history

btw, how much to insure the cossie??


...art

You will not get a NCB-type discount under any circumstances.  You were driving
under your dad's policy, with a NCD in his name.  Any accident you had would
have affected his insurance not yours.  So logically any benefits go to him
and not you.

The only way your clean licence will benefit you is that you won't get charged
any *extra* for being a bad driver.

Considered a sex change?  Women get cheaper insurance than men.  The premium
is also cheaper if you're married.

I'm afraid you have few options: either drive a lower-risk car (eg 1973 Mini
850 ;-) until you've built up enough NCD to afford to insure your dream car,
like the rest of us mere mortals have to, or cough up the cash.

Or you could always go "on the scheme" and get a lease-mobile...

Scott

You could also try the Co-op. I was amazed to find that my neighbour
who was about 23 and five (ahem) years younger than myself was paying
half my premium for a group higher car (just after I'd renewed). I
don't have their number, but they're doubtless in the book.

Steve.

    
    I used to be insured with the Co-op, but they don't like high group
    cars much!. 
    
    Considering your situation the quotes you have received don't seem to
    bad. Try some specialist insurers, but basically you are an extremely
    bad risk yo insurers (just the type some insurers brag that they don't
    insure), so if you can get insurance you'll have to pay.
    
    Some insurers give a discount for IAM/ROSPA type additional training,
    so perhaps that might be worth taking.
    
    Mark	

Thanks for the comments so far...

Art, the Cossie was the one that cost 3K...  And an RS Turbo, you know,
the Escort, Bennetts have put into Group 9 (less than a 325i and the
16V Astra) because young people like to drive them...  It's cruel...

Do people think it's wise/safe to continue being a named driver on
someone else's insurance ?  If I were to have an accident is it
likely that the Insurance Company would get upset and not pay ?

Scott, I think a sex change is a just little drastic...  But, none
the less, worth keeping in mind. :-)

I'd love a lease/copmpany car, worth it's weight and all that but
unfortunately I don't work for Digital...  This is another of the
reasons I want an expensive car -- it's good for the tax.

I've written to the Co-op (aka CIC ?) and am awaiting a reply.  I'll
let you know what thay say.

The companies the brag about how much they like young high risk
drivers with three years driving ban also like your money...  I've
found even more so than the well established types that seem more
"reasonable" in all areas.

Do any garages still offer "free insurance" or has that craze finished
now, or is it only for new cars ?


Thanks, Peter.

>>Do any garages still offer "free insurance" or has that craze finished
>>now, or is it only for new cars ?

did see an ad in a recent free paper in Reading; it was Vauxhall offering
free insurance on the astra gte (don't know if it applies to the 16v) amongst
other things (AA, servicing etc)

i've also heard ads on capitol radio from Ford dealers that offer free insurance
on all cars (including used) but that was before christmas


>>Do people think it's wise/safe to continue being a named driver on
>>someone else's insurance ?  If I were to have an accident is it
>>likely that the Insurance Company would get upset and not pay ?

i thought insurance companies put an end to this by working the premium out 
based on the highest risk driver (ie. you as opposed to your dad)

they might not pay up if they find out that you're the 'main' driver of the car
(which would be difficult to contest if you're the cars owner/keeper)

�3k is not bad for a cossie; i was quoted �2.2k for a 1.6 honda CRX (non vtec)

a R5Gtt is quicker (& cheaper to insure) than the escort RS turbo

...art

>Do people think it's wise/safe to continue being a named driver on
>someone else's insurance ?  If I were to have an accident is it
>likely that the Insurance Company would get upset and not pay ?

    No, it's not particularly wise.  Assuming that you are the main driver
    in your car, then technically you are probably not insured under your
    dad's policy.  This of course means that you are committing an offence.
    
    Although I'm sure that many people get away with this, insurance
    companies have a habit of becoming very suspicious at the slightest
    opportunity.  I have a friend who works for the Norwich Union motor
    insurance section.  You should see the smile of glee on his face when
    he tells me about people who have been caught out in this way!  It's
    not a very nice sight... :-)
    
    The sooner you get insured, the sooner you'll get your NCD.  Just tell
    yourself that you really enjoy paying 10% of your salary out, never to
    see it again.  (Well, you should *hope* that you never have to see it
    again... having an accident isn't the best way to get your money back!)
    
    Mat.
    *:o)
    
    PS  I agree with the earlier comments about starting off with an
    easy-to-insure car.  Want to buy a Beetle off me?
    

    
    I noticed that you said you didn't work for Digital - does that mean
    you are a contractor? - and that your company is buying/leasing the
    car? If the car belongs to your company, some insurers will add an
    additional premium, even if you can convince them that you are not
    using it as a business vehicle. (So watch that the story to the tax man
    and the Insurance co. are the same(-ish) :-)  ) My Landy cost me an
    additional �16 - on top of �160 (fully comp + trailer + modified
    vehicle and 60%NCD), just because the vehicle is owned by my company,
    although registered in my name. For your sake I hope it is a flat rate,
    not a % of the full premium!

    
    I think you'll find most people reading this conference will have
    had some kind of small (low insurance group) car to start off with...
    
    Its always the best way...build up on your NO CLAIMS BONUS. Most
    insurance companies offer 30% no claims bonus after your first year.
    
    Wouldn't it be worth it to wait until your at least 21 years old
    and have some no claims behind you..Your going to have to do it
    some day.!!! SO why not start now....?
    
    Actually, I'm really surprised that you even got a quote for some
    of those cars. A lot of insurance companies wouldn't even consider
    you...
    
    I used to work for a car rental firm and drove all the
    BMW's, FORD's, FERRARI's, PORSCHE's, MERC's and the best out of
    all of those (exluding porsche's and ferrari's) was the cossie and
    the merc 560sec...but obviously the cossie was a lot cheaper than
    the merc...
    
    CRAIG..
    
    
    

    
    	My advise is similar to -1.   In fact you can take it a step
    further and make a case that anyone with a high group car (and a NCB)
    should buy a 750 cc wreck,  insure it 3rd party,  and leave it in your
    garden.     Should you be unlucky enough to have claim,  switch the NCB
    from the wreck to your newly repaired mega-car.
    
    	My insurance broker couldn't find a reason why this wouldn't work,
    but the insurance companies will probably find some small print
    somewhere.    I don't know why people make jokes about
    used-car-salesman; insurance companies seem the sharks of the motor
    trade to me.
    
    	Anyway,  the only useful thing to the youthful prospective 325i
    owner (do I note a hint of jealously in some of these replies?), 
    assuming you decide not to insure in your own name,  is to get some
    form of cheap insurance policy started asap.   In a couple of years,
    once the hair starts receeding (or greying),  and the eye-sight and
    reactions start going,  you'll become a nice insurable member of
    society.
    
    	Cliff (who must be old as it's years since I moaned about an
    insurance premium)

    Try Halfords (address posted elsewhere) as they give DEC employees 30%
    discount. Don't know what their policy is on high risk areas though.
    
    I'm glad being over 40 has ONE benefit ..........
    
    

>>    Try Halfords (address posted elsewhere) as they give DEC employees 30%
>>    discount. Don't know what their policy is on high risk areas though.


halfords don't cover cars like this; just average family runabouts.


guess you'll have to swallow hard and stump up a lot of money to drive the car 
of your dreams  :-(

...art

Ok, I think the idea of insuring a Fiesta (or somesuch) and
waiting for a year is a good one.  It's just not much fun...
Just a thought, if I insure two (or more) nasties, after the
year's up, can I add the NCDs together ?  Didn't think so :-(

I am a contractor, but I don't own my own company, I'm
self-employed (Schedule D) but fear not, I never mentioned this...

I think I might keep the XR for another year on my Dad's insurance.

It's a shame really, seing as this end of the second hand car market
is in such a state...  I mean, there's real bargains to be had...


Thanks for your comments, Peter.

	 
    
    
    PETER....
    
    You say your going to carry on being insured on your dad's insurance
    Is the XR3i your own car or your dad's ?
    
    Because, if your thinking of spending 1/3 grand on insurance for a
    more prestige car...Use that money to get your own insurance and
    get off your dad's. The years your on your dad's insurance are just
    going to be wasted..
    
    We all have our dreams...I have had a mk1 cavalier (after that I
    got 30% no claims), mk2 cavalier 1600SR (another 10%) and now I
    have got 40% to use for my next car, plus you get older and that
    helps.....
    
    craig..
    
    
    

Craig, the XR3i is almost as high to insure as the cars in .0.

If I insure a Fiesta for 200, the interest on the 2K that I didn't
spend will reimburse me :-)  So, this time next year, I should
have 30% off + another 10% for being 21...  3000 - 40% = �1200

Still sounds a lot of money...  Hopefully for nothing...

Thinking about it, I spect the fine for having no insurance would
be less :-)  (Not that I'd consider having no insurance...)

If I were to buy a new car (cringe) with "free" insurance, would
I receive the years no claims ?


Peter.

According to the ads around News at Ten last night, if you buy
a super Proton with all sorts of gismos like electric windows,
sunroof, multi-valve (at least 8) engine, carpets etc. you
can get 2% finance and two years insurance for �99, and the cars
are dead cheap too. They're made in Malaysia.

Steve.

    
>Thinking about it, I spect the fine for having no insurance would
>be less :-)  (Not that I'd consider having no insurance...)
    
    You're probably right about the fine.  Just try to get someone to
    insure you afterwards though... might find it a little
    tricky/expensive!
    
    Mat.
    *:o)
    

    Not driving without insurance is considered by the police to be just
    about the most dangerous thing you can do.
    
    The fine is astronomical and you can get banned for a long time / many
    points for this. This applies even if you were driving a 900cc Fiesta.
    
    There is a very good reason for this...
    
    If you were to knock over and permanently disable (or God forbid kill) a
    young child then you would be PERSONNALY liable for the costs. This could
    the 100,000s of pounds. Of course you couldn't pay (otherwise you wouldn'd
    be moaning about the cost of insurance :-). So the poor child would
    have to go without damages - Not very nice.
    
    	Rik

    Craig,
    
    The one and only REAL choice you have is to get off you Dad's insurance
    and start building up that NCB.
    
    I started my own insurance when i was 17, and now i'm 20 with 3 year
    NCB... it really helps! The insurers seem to think a lot more of a 
    ``youngster'' with No claims bonuses... although the prices still seem
    WAY too high to me ;-)
    
    The Co-op have in my experience been the cheapest and most helpful
    company i have used. 
    
    So get your own policy started... the sooner the better...
    
    
    				Lewis.

    Whilst on the subject of insurance...
    
    As .19 suggested, I got off my 'old mans' insurance when I was 18.
    Consequently i'm now 22 and have 4 years NCD, ( 60% ). Now that
    i've finally reached this stage I want to protect it, ie, pay a
    little more so that should I have an accident I don't lose any of
    my NCD. This protection normally allows for up to 3 accidents in
    5 years. However, my current insurance company have recently passed
    the wonderful rule of having to be over 25 to protect your NCD.
    
    Anybody out there know of an insurance company that lets you protect
    your hard earned NCD when you're a youngster of 22 ?
    
    Dave.
    

    Re.-1
    
    Yes, the Co-op. I have maximum NCB and have protected it for a small
    extra fee, I am 22.
    
    						Geo.

    Craig,
    	As Mark pointed out in .4 you can get cheap insurance through the
    IAM. I assume it still runs, when I passed by IAM test 10 years ago,
    I got 50% off by using their Milestones insurance at Lloyds.
    
    You could also consider getting a cheap (to insure) car and getting
    your kicks on a bike, and leave the Cossie until you're 30...
    
    Also, I was at the Kit Car show last year, and a couple of insurance
    companies were there who seemed to specialise in the unusual. I got a
    quote from one of them to insure my Cossie for �750 fully comp *AFTER*
    I told them about the 305bhp BBR conversion. That suggests that they
    may consider someone of more tender years. Unfortunately I can't
    remember the name of the company, and the info is back home in England,
    but I imagine they would advertise in KitCar magazine, or maybe one of
    our KitCar builders might know...
    
    Rob
    

    re .22
    Sorry, I meant Peter, not Craig - I haven't woken up yet this year...

    
    You could try Adrian S.Flux.
    
    Some say they aren't the cheapest, but in my experience, they try to
    be.
    
    Mark

    
    re .24 We use Adrian S Flux for both our cars (one Kit Car, and one
    Modified Vehicle) they are very helpful, seem to know what they are
    talking about, and when we had to claim for the fire in the 23, they
    did their best to speed things up, and we had the cheque in our
    posession within a few days of submitting our final claim.
    
    If you want their number, it's in another note somewhere, or I've
    probably got it with me somewhere if you want me to have a look!
    
    Elaine
    

    If you are into accepting some of the risk yourself, you could probably
    reduce the premium quite a lot by accepting some kind of monstrous
    excess. Ask the brokers - or maybe you already have.
    
    Steve

 Have you tried David Auden & Associates 061-483 3241. I hav my insurance with 
them and they know what they are on about. And they were the cheapest I could 
find about 1 1/2 years ago for a modified MK2 Escort aged 19 with 1 years 
no-claims.

 I was amazed at how much difference it makes when you are 21 as opposed to less
as unfortunately I am going to have to insure the Sprint about a month before
my 21st and it will be around 80 quid more (well for a years it will, but I
am changing in the middle, so it is actually less, but minor points).



		 Alan
		~~~~~~

    
    Have you tried Endsleigh ?  They do 'cheap' insurance for students & Joe 
    public up to the age of 26 ish. Both the times I bought motorbike insurance,
    and the once that I bought contents insurance for my flat from them, were 
    cheaper than the CO-OP ( the next cheapest alternative in all cases ). 
    
    FWIW
    			Nik.

    It depends somewhat on the circumstances...
    
    I had a renewal note through on a MG metro (E reg) for qpprox 800.
    Admittedly I had one claim for 600 in the previous year which happened
    to be my first.
    
    I ended up shopping round and got a much better quote from Bennetts.
    
    Helen.

Thanks for all your help and advice...

The Co-op (CIS) will not insure any car above group 7.  They did
quote me for an R reg 1300 Capri which they say is in group 2 at a
price of �352, which seems a little excessive...

Anyway, I've found A-Plan in Newbury to be the cheapest.  Fully
Comp for the Cossy is 2.5k.  2k for a Nissan 200SX or 1.9 for
a 325i.

I'm gonna bite the bullett and go for it while I can still afford
to...  The only question remaining, do I go for the looks of the
Nissan, the speed of the Cossy or the electric head rests in the
BM ?


Cheers, Peter.

	2.5K insurance.......now I know why the lease scheme is so expensive!



	Heather

    You must have much more money than sense.
    
    You only live once - but don't pay for it all rightaway.
    
    J.R.
    
    PS - If you do get one of the cars you mentioned, take care !

>>Comp for the Cossy is 2.5k.  2k for a Nissan 200SX or 1.9 for

it really amazes me that the pug 1.9 costs SO much to insure surely it's not
THAT fast - maybe they're the sort of cars run by accident prone drivers?!
parts for them can't be in such short supply/fantastically expensive - or are
they?

the Cossie is leagues above the pug performance wise, yet it's cheaper to insure
the Cossie (for me) than the GTI


...art

RE: -.1

the way I read it, Barmy Peter was saying �1,900 for a 325i. The 1.9 was
'misleading'.

Steve

>>                      <<< Note 1335.30 by BARMY::PETER >>>
>>                           -< You only live once... >-

>>Comp for the Cossy is 2.5k.  

>>I'm gonna bite the bullett and go for it while I can still afford
to...  
    
    
    node::username says it all!
    
    Richard :-)

Yeah, sorry it was the �1,900 for the 325i (not the Pug)...

But along the same lines, the RS Turbo Escort costs more to insure
than _all_ the other 'hot hatch' type cars.  It's in Group 9 where
as the 16V Astra is in 8.  This is because "These cars seem to attract
younger drivers" as explained to me by the man at Bennetts, if
memory serves.


Peter.

Re .33

Don't be amazed....1,900 pounds for a Pug 1.9 for me would be cheap!!
I was quoted 2,500, or 3,000 with installments by Swinton, I didn't have
the nerve to ask about a cossy 8-) 

..Craig  (who is 20, single(ish) and handsome)

    Get them Patriots up you BM drivers! :^)
    
    Mark

    
    re .40
    
    You just can't talk to some people.
    
    Now back to writing the service interval program for a BMW...
    
    Service_interval = RND(X).
    
    Mark :^)

	On the question of insurance..

	Given that a large % of the cars on the roads of Britain (or sliding off
	in this weather) are foreign, how do the insurance companies get away
	with automatically upping the insurance group by one if the car's
	'foreign'?

	My mum's just cough up for a new Nissan Micra after getting rid of
	the Fieta and was not chuffed when she found this out.

	Paul.

    
    It's supposedly to do with the greater cost of parts for foreign cars.
    
    An example of how silly it can get is that my Vauxhall Cavalier Coupe
    was a group lower than the identical car with an Opel badge!
    
    Mark

�    An example of how silly it can get is that my Vauxhall Cavalier Coupe
�    was a group lower than the identical car with an Opel badge!
    
    Just another excuse for Insurance Companies to 'screw the punters' !
    
    If they were to apply this rule correctly, would not all Ford and GM
    vehicles be classed as foreign (U.S.) ?
    
    J.R.

I'll be returning to the UK later this year, after some time in Massachusetts
(home of some of the world's worst drivers). I've been in contact with my 
former UK insurance brokers who tell me that I will be able to continue my 
three years/50% no claims bonus from two and a bit years ago (though only 
a few companies offer this, they add).

What are the current NCB rates? I know 3 years is 50%. What is 4 years (65%?), 
and is full no-claims bonus 4 or 5 years? 

John

    4/5 years seems to both be 60%, with some companies offering either 65%
    the following year or two years protected bonus if you stay at 60%.

    Re 1538.137
    
>>    what they base the insurance cost on.
>>    Maybe I mistakenly typed FERRARI instead of FRONTERA on the quote form.
    
    Since the AA sent me some 'junk mail' asking me to get a quote from them,
    I filled in the details for a Ferrari 308GT4, 1977 model, 15K value.
    
    The reply came back - 860 pounds (full ncb).  Not too bad, is it ?
    
    J.R.

My 1978 model cost about that with just 3yr NCB from Norwich Union.

Tony.